Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. The color of your next rebirth — burnt-log black for hell beings, smoke-grey for animals, gold for humans and desire-realm gods — opens this nearly two-hour session with Geshe Pema Tsering, as he works through the later divisions of the bardo in the Middle Lamrim. He explains how virtue and nonvirtue produce a moonlit or pitch-dark intermediate state, how attachment to familiar objects pulls beings unknowingly toward their next birth, and the mechanics of consciousness entering the womb. He then turns to renunciation, arguing it must carry the urgency of escaping a burning house — not the casual wish that vanishes in the next moment — and corrects the misconception that bodhisattvas need not cultivate it. A Q&A covers whether last-minute virtue can guard against lower rebirth, and how karma ripens through gathered causes and conditions, illustrated through a seed-and-flower analogy.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 13 2009 05 07 BP.mp3
UUID: 705b7c9e-6acf-455e-a2e2-df97042b6388
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: Middle Lam Rim (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2009-05-07
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 113.9 minutes
Words: ~7,041
Mhmm. Yeah. So we just move on from where we where we were last last Thursday. So how the intermediate state is reached after death. So we there’s many, many divisions.
There are nine divisions of this of this topic, and we’ve been through the the first two from where the bardo was accomplished, from the shape of the intermediate being and so forth. And then now third, how the appearance of the intermediate state appears to those who have created virtue and nonvirtue. Okay. So I was just going briefly for the text again. Intermediate state, the intermediate existence of those who have created a nonvirtue appears like a black cloth or like a dark night, whereas the intermediate the intermediate existence of those who have created virtue appears like a white blanket or a moonlit night.
Then as for how it sees, how the intermediate state being sees, we are told again it sees intermediate state beings of similar type as and this translation in English doesn’t make sense to me, but as well as their and its own birth birth source. So they see, intermediate beings of similar type, and they can see, you know, the the the place and the types of beings in which they’re going to be born, the the realm and the type of beings in which they’re going to be born. So, again, if if you are going to be reborn as a human, you have a similar a format that’s similar to the human form and you see all the beings which have the same form, so you see the similar type here, the same birth what is referred to as birth source or the place of that of birth. Okay. And then as for the the color, again, are told in the Entry into the Womb Sūtra, it says that the intermediate state of hell beings is like the color of a burnt log.
The intermediate state of animals is like smoke. The intermediate state of hungry ghosts is like water. The intermediate state of the desire realm gods gods and human beings is like gold, and the intermediate state of the form realm gods is white. Then the sixth is the distinction of whether there is or there is not an intermediate state. So if you are reborn from the formless realm into the two lower realms, the form and the desire realm, there is an intermediate state.
However, if you are born from those two realms, the two those two lower realms, the desire and the form realm, into the formless realm, the aggregates of the formless realm are accomplished wherever you die, and there is no intermediate state. Okay? Then as for how it travels, again, it is thought that the intermediate state of gods travels upright, that of humans travels straight ahead, that of those who have done faulty actions or negativities, again, with eyes cast downward travel upside down. The intention is similar, for the three bad migrations. So, again, those with the faulty actions of the the going to any of the three bad migrations.
They travel the same way. And as for their lifespan, again, the lifespan is is that if it does not find the conditions for rebirth, it abides for as as many as seven days. If if it finds them, if it finds those conditions, the number of days is uncertain. Also, if it does not find them, it exchanges bodies and abides up to seven times, seven days. However, it does not abide any longer than that since it will definitely find the conditions for rebirth before then.
Then the manner of changing into another intermediate state. So having died and transferred after seven days in the intermediate state of a god. For example, the intermediate state of a god or alternatively, the intermediate state of a human being is accomplished because through the changing activity of other karma, the seed of the intermediate, state changes, and it is the same for other intermediate states. Geshe-la moves on to the next topic straight away again. How you take rebirth in a birth existence, how you take the next rebirth.
So for the first of those topics, there’s there’s there’s five divisions of this topic. The first one, how you transfer into an intermediate state, into an intermediate existence through a mind of attachment and so forth. So in many, in the in the sūtra, which is the the many levels, again, it is taught that when you are born in a womb, I guess, I was just making reference to the fact that there are four different types of rebirth traditionally. You know, there’s a womb, egg, miraculous rebirth, or birth from moisture moisture, which is a traditional thing. So so if you are born when you are born in a womb, a mistaken perception arises with regards to the semen and the blood or the egg of your father and mother respectively.
In that moment, like like an illusion, you see your parents to be having intercourse even though they are not, and you develop attachment to them. So Geshe is going for the text again, which says, however, the the the commentary on the treasury of knowledge then explains that you see your parents actually having intercourse. Then furthermore, if you are to be born as a female, you desire to be rid of the woman and become attached to the man and want to have intercourse with him. If you are to be born as a male, you desire to be rid of the man and become attached to the woman and want to have intercourse with her. Once this kind of desire has arisen, the closer you approach, other body parts of that man and woman no longer appear, and you only see the male and female signs becoming angry at that, the intermediate state being dies and transfers and and is reborn.
So Geshe-la goes on to the next topic again, what object the consciousness connects with and how? Furthermore, when there is a situation of intense attachment between father and mother at the very and sorry, when there is a situation of intense attachment, lust of father and mother at the very at the very end, thick fluid emerges. After that, two drops of semen and blood or egg doubtlessly emerge from the two two. Through the mixing of the two in the birth source of the mother, something like, for instance, boiled milk that has cooled down and and congealed is formed. The the that becoming so so close, one does not one does not distinguish anymore the the the specific features of the father and the mother.
One just perceives the general has a general perception of one male being and one female being. That’s all that one sees. So one doesn’t see the signs as as in the the specific features of each one. So one, again, one only one perceives. So, again, one doesn’t see one doesn’t see all the because the the word that was translated as signs is making reference to usually refers to all the limbs and the specific parts of of the bodies and and specific features of the bodies of the father and mother.
So one does that doesn’t appear anymore. One only sees one only has a general perception of what says here, the merely the perception of male and female. One knows that one is male and the other female, but one doesn’t see all the the features and so forth. Then at the same time that the intermediate’s existence terminates by the power of consciousness that joins, the consciousness that is reincarnating, the subtle parts of the great elements of the sense powers which are other than that, congealed mass and the combination of semen and blood that accord with that mixture arise as ordained along with the sense powers. And Geshe lah is just explaining, again, this subtle parts of the great elements of the sense power.
So these elements are the, you know, the the, you know, earth, fire, water, wind. Those are those are the elements. And then as as these elements evolve from from their subtle parts into more coarse parts, then the body progressively forms. Then, Geshe-la goes on, so the consciousness that enters at that time is posited as the mind basis of all by those who accept a mind basis of all, such as the mind only school, proponents of the mind only. And those who do not accept a mind basis of all assert that it is the mental consciousness that joins.
And, Geshe-la, I was just making being more specific. It is a very subtle very subtle mental consciousness that transfers from one life to the next since beginningless time. Just let’s go in for the text again. So, again, the next topic, you are not born in bad birth sources. Again, it’s the abode of birth.
Birth sources is place the place where we you’re you’re going to be born. So the birth the abode of rebirth, the realm where you’re going to be born. So unless the Bardo being wishes to go there. So the text goes on and says, if there is no desire to go to a birth abode, the Bardo being will not go there. And if it has not gone there, it will not be born there.
Therefore, when the Bardo being of someone possessing no vows who created and accumulated an action for rebirth in hell, such as killing sheep or trading in poultry or pigs and the like, sees as if in a dream sheep and so forth at his birth source, at his birth abode. This person, this being then rushes there with the delight of previous familiarity. Then having become angry at the form of his or her birth abode, the intermediate existence ends, and he or she is born in the birth existence. Likewise, rebirth as a hell being, a hungry ghost with goiter, etcetera, is similar to this. English, I’ll just read again the the very last bit again.
Sorry. Then having become angry at the form of the birth source, the intermediate set of existence ends, and he or she is born in the birth existence. And likewise, for other other lower migrations, again, the birth is a hell being hungry ghost with goiter, etcetera. It occurs in a similar way. And Geshe-la is explaining Geshe-la is explaining what is meant, what is being said here.
So again, if one one one is born in intermediate state, and then what what we have to pause it then how how the transition from the intermediate state, how this transfer from this intermediate state into the next rebirth occurs. So if in this an intermediate state being, again, in the case of this illustration, will not be born in hell if that being does not wish to be born in hell. Now how how is it that that being is born in hell? It’s by by having developed a habituation, a familiarity with non-virtues that leads to rebirth in hell. That being will then see those objects of those non-virtues that the the being has a liking for that for those non virtues, for that for that for those actions with which he or she is familiar with.
The being see those objects of those non virtues and goes after them unknowingly. Just goes after the objects, but it is going then in the direction of the hell realm in this case, because of this example. It’s going the direction of the hell realm unknowingly, and and then the birth, the transfer occurs. Okay? Then how how you are reborn in the bad migrations as an animal and so forth.
So in the actual basis of the levels, which is this sūtra, it says that if you are to be born as an animal, a hungry ghost, a human being, or as a god enjoying the desire and form realms, you will see delightful beings of similar type to yourself at your birth abode at this at at your place of birth. Then through generating delight in and desire for that, you go there. Then having become angry at this birth abode, the intermediate state existence ceases, and you are born in the birth existence. And then the way in which someone who has non vows, who does not trade in chicken, pigs and so forth, is born in hell is similar to this. I was just going through this this expression, which is, someone who has no doesn’t have vows is in a person who has no has no restraint for this great negativities.
And Geshe-la was giving the illustration of somebody who who is a soldier, who who goes to war, who accepts killing as as something that is alright to be done and then and performs killing. So such a person is a person who has no vows, has no restraints. And, again, the same for, you know, a butcher who is trading in in animals, in the in the flesh of animals. He’s he’s killing the animals and selling the animals and so on. Again, such a person would be be such a person that has no vows and has no restraints.
Again, And then five, again, from from among the four birth sources, how you are born from heat and moisture, and how you are miraculously born. So in the treasury of of knowledge, we just said again, others strongly desire odors and an abode. So others than than the ones who are going to be born through a womb or egg. So they strongly desire odors and then abode. It is mentioned saying that if you are to be born from heat and moisture, and you are born through desiring odors, and if you are to be born miraculously, you are born through desiring and abode Moreover, the commentary explains that if you are to be born in the hot hells you go to an intermediate existence through desiring heat Whereas if you are to be born in the cold hells you go to an intermediate existence for desiring freshness, coolness.
The commentary on the treasury of knowledge explains birth from an egg to be similar to birth from a womb. And the measure that those thoughts common to renunciation have arisen, there’s two parts to that. So first, indicating the measure of their having arisen purely. So if you have come to understand the characteristics of cyclic existence in detail from the point of view of the true suffering, sufferings and and their origins, and the desire to abandon them and the desire to attain their complete pacification have arisen, there is indeed the attitude of renunciation. However, that alone is not sufficient.
Therefore, you should generate that mind to the extent of being like the mind that does not want to be stuck in a house ablaze with fire or stay locked up in prison and to the extent that it it desires liberation from them. And even then, is necessary to still increase it. Alright? All these four types of birth, you know, the womb and the egg and so forth, they happen due to by the force of contaminated actions and the afflict and afflictions. And this is something that we do not want.
We do not want to be, again, slaves of the contaminated actions and the afflictions anymore. So we want we we have to develop this mind that wishes to to let go of them, to to give to get rid of them, to abandon them, the contaminated actions and the afflictions. So we need to in order to be able to develop this mind, and we need to develop a very solid understanding of true sufferings and the true origins of sufferings. And with this, we’ll be able to develop my mind that wants to be free from it. But Geshe-la was saying, but it’s not it’s not just how can I say that?
It’s not the casual thought that we we because we can all develop this give rise to this desire to be free from it. But it’s not it’s not casual. It’s not something, you know, that that we it’s not like we do in a in a moment and and just let go in the next moment. Geshe-la Geshe-la was explaining some of the expressions here. So it says, you know, though these thoughts that we do have, that we we can all we can all produce, which is to abandon them, to abandon the sufferings and their origins.
Again, a desire to attain complete pacification of them, and and this is what is referred to as renunciation. So Geshe-la was then saying, so we can all give rise to these thoughts, the wish to be free from true sufferings and true origins, and then and then we should attain liberation. We all and and then when we when we have this thought, this desire, there is renunciation that but Geshe-la was explaining with the precise little words, some of the words that are the the particles that are used in Tibetan, he’s saying that can be named. You can label that renunciation, but that is not the actual the end renunciation that we are seeking. That is that is, you know, there is a a temporary, a very fickle renunciation.
So we give rise to this thought, and, again, Geshe-la said again, in the next moment, it vanishes. And that’s that is is not the goal that we are seeking. The renunciation that we are seeking is something that is stable and lasting. Alright? So Geshe-la was then saying, so how is it then that we what is the quality then of the mind of renunciation that we have to produce then?
So the the the mind of renunciation has to have the same intensity as that mind that that wishes to be free or or get out of this of of of a house that is totally on fire. So if you were in a house that is totally enveloped in fire, then you would have a very intense, very urgent than wish desire to get out of there. And the same way or or in the same way if you are in in jail, if you are in prison you have a very strong wish a very intense desire to get free of that to get out of the jail get out of the prison so when you have such a mind, such a desire to be out of cyclic existence with out of this the suffering of the lower realms, out of the suffering of of of the entirety of cyclic existence with that intensity, and you continually, then you you easily then attain this noncontrived, such a noncontrived mind of renunciation. And that is what that that is what we want to develop. This is this is our goal.
If I move on to the next topic, the development of nothing but an appearance of striving for liberation if nothing if nothing but mediocre renunciation has developed. If this attitude as taught by Sharawa is nothing more than mediocre, like flour dropped into sour milk. Also, the view that does not want the causes, the origins of cyclic existence will not become more than that. Then accordingly, one’s striving for liberation, the cessation, there is the ceasing of sufferings and origins of suffering, will be similar to that, mediocre. Because of that, the desire to accomplish the path of liberation will be mere words, will be nothing than more than mere words.
And, also, there being no basis for the compassion that cannot bear the suffering of other sentient beings, roaming in cyclic existence, the uncontrived mind of unsurpassed enlightenment that has the power to spur the mind on will not arise. Consequently, you become a Mahāyānist only in your understanding that follows upon words. For that reason, you should cultivate these thoughts again and again. And Geshe-la was just noting in the end, this is this is our main object of training for this understanding, all of us. This is this is our main, major training for us.
And Geshe-la was saying it’s important. It’s it’s extremely important for us then to cultivate renunciation as as a foundation, foundation, a prerequisite for everything else that we want to accomplish in our spiritual practice. Because without without renunciation, then we will not have, you know, the real desire to be free from the cycle of existence, and then we will we will remain being pushed around in the cycle of existence, being born here in the in in the cycle of existence. Then, Geshe-la moves on to the next topic, eliminating misconceptions about this. So there’s two major divisions to that, the manner of the misconceptions and their elimination.
As for the manner of the misconceptions, then we are told if you may think if you cultivate extreme revulsion and disenchantment for cyclic existence like the hearers, you will fail you will fall, sorry, you will fall into the extreme of peace because of your dislike for, reentering cyclic existence. Therefore, while it is becoming for to cultivate this enchantment, it is inappropriate for Bodhisattvas to cultivate it. That is explained in this Sūtra of the unfathomable secret. So, Geshe-la, just explain it. So, what this misconception is saying is that it is alright for the Hinayanists than to cultivate this revulsion and this this disenchantment for cyclic existence, cultivate renunciation because they want to be free from the entirety of cyclic existence, and they want to attain liberation for themselves.
But it is not alright for because they want to remain in cyclic existence for the sake of other sentient beings. So it’s not alright for them to do so. So then the the the elimination of this misconception, so again, there’s four parts to that. First, the meaning of the statements in the scriptures that bodhisattvas are not terrified by cyclic existence. So the meaning of such statements as thus, a bodhisattva should not be terrified by cyclic existence.
It should not be afraid of cyclic existence. It’s not to point out it’s not to say that the bodhisattva should not be repulsed at the sufferings of birth, aging, illness, death, and so on, of roaming in cyclic existence under the power of contaminated karma and the mental afflictions. Rather, it is that due to the bodhisattva’s mind of enlightenment, the bodhisattva should not be afraid to take rebirth and existence for the benefit of sentient beings under the power of aspirational prayers and compassion. This one. Then how it is necessary to enjoy being reborn in cyclic existence due to compassion, but to be terrified of rebirth and cyclic existence due to contaminated actions and the afflictions.
So, again, in fact, if roaming in cyclic sorry, if roaming in existence under the power of contaminated karma and the mental afflictions. We are tormented by many sufferings and unable to enact even our own welfare. One need is there to mention enacting others’ welfare. Since it is the door to all degeneration having to mention sorry. Since it is a door to all degeneration having developed more disenchantment than the Hinayanists, there is a need to block it while it is necessary to enjoy taking rebirth and existence under the power of aspirational prayers and compassion.
And then we have this quote from the sūtra which says, again, bodhisattvas, through taking care of thoroughly ripened sentient beings view cyclic existence to be beneficial unlike the great passage to nirvana, to nirvana. Then next topic again for those with vows of engagement in the bodhisattva behavior of engaging bodhicitta who express themselves in this manner without differentiating between the rebirth due to karma and mental afflictions and rebirth due to aspiration, appraise, etcetera, infractions infractions occur. Then we are told again in the bodhisattva levels, is set out that if someone who expresses himself or herself in the above manner without differentiating between them, between these two types of rebirth, by force, which I wasn’t saying by force of contaminated actions and afflictions or by force of pure aspiration of prayers and compassion. Then as a person has Bodhisattva vows, then that person commits an afflicted infraction of the Bodhisattva vows. Then lastly, then again, cherishing the way of conduct without falling falling into the extreme of peace despite great revulsion for cyclic existence.
So, again, the way of conduct of of Bodhisattvas once again. Having developed revulsion for cyclic existence to see those those sentient beings as one’s relatives, and thus generate the mind of enlightenment for their sake is the intention of the Four Hundred Verses of Candrakīrti, and it’s clearly set out by the great master Candrakīrti and his commentary on that text. And and so Geshe-la is saying the whole point being that bodhisattvas or beings who aspire to engage in the Mahāyāna path, to train the Mahāyāna path, they must also develop renunciation. It’s vital that one develops renunciation, especially if one wants to be to become a bodhisattva. Because in order to become a bodhisattva, in order to develop bodhicitta, one has to develop compassion.
One and one has to develop that in dependence on the understanding of the sufferings of all the sentient beings. And one can only develop that in dependence on the understanding of one’s own sufferings. So one has to understand the sufferings of existence and the ones how one is afflicted by the sufferings. And so that one can develop the compassion for others, and one can develop bodhicitta and then engaging in the path that leads to the well-being of of all of all beings. I’m just asking the Geshe to to to stop here today because I’m I’m not feeling great.
So, yeah, if you have any questions, you can ask now. Yes. Were accustomed to doing would would draw them into certain things. Well, what about things who most of life have committed bad actions? And for the last remainder of the life, they, you know, made up the prayers and change the ways.
So Geshe-la is saying, look, of course, this is a very broad question. It’s hard to get into specifics. But, generally speaking, the person in the last, you know, two, three years of the person’s life, the person was, you know, really engaged in virtue. You know, really, you know, for the majority of the time, the person was doing real virtue, not what we think is virtue, but real virtue. And it was took really took refuge, like real refuge with, you know, the whole lot.
And then it was doing purification of negativities and all that. And then so, you know, there is a great chance, there’s a good chance that the person will be protected from the from the lower realms because the person took refuge and all that. If they really took refuge, not what we do here and also real refuge. Okay? One has real refuge, then one has that protection.
And Geshe-la was saying moreover that if the person is then has done such a good job that at the at the time of death itself, the person has a virtuous mind, has virtue in in his or her mind, then the next rebirth is guaranteed to be a good one. Alright. Right? And then Geshe-la was then pointing out to what we have already gone through. I think in in the previous Thursday or the Thursday before last, there was a teaching about just that again, saying that we were told if was telling us, and, yeah, at the time of death, you know, if somebody is dying with a virtuous mind, even somebody who has performed negativities for his or her whole life, if the person is dying with a virtuous mind in the next birth, it’s going to be a virtuous one.
Sorry. A higher a happy migration. And, again, even somebody who has performed virtuous for his or her whole life, if at the time of death, a person is overpowered by a mind of attachment or aversion or anger and so forth, the person’s going to be born in in the one of the lower realms and gonna have a suffering rebirth, bad migration. So that’s that’s the crucial moment. So, Geshe-la was in a sense, so the next next birth is determined at the time of death.
So but it is not to say and, again, the illustration of the the person who has performed negativities, his or her whole life. And the time of death has died with a virtuous mind, was born in a happy migration. It’s not to say that those negativities are erased, and the person starts with a clean slate in the next life. No. That those negative those negative actions have been performed, and one will have to experience the results of the negative actions.
If not in the next life, in the life in in the future time if the person hasn’t purified it. So yes. So, so this is this is how it is. The time of death the the mind that we have at the time of death is of great importance. Now it is whilst we are still alive, before we die, that we it is crucial that we habituate ourselves, that we familiarize ourselves with with virtuous minds so that at the time of death, a virtuous mind will come easily.
If we don’t habituate ourselves with a virtuous mind, it will become it will be very difficult to for a virtuous mind to arise at the time of death. So that is why it is so important that we practice virtue now. Is that okay? Yeah. Yes.
What determines whether the results of actions or experience in the next life or three lifetimes, I think, or what? As opposed to this life. Because I wasn’t saying, well, some some So those things are you know, because I was gonna say he’s pointing out that it’s hard to to define precisely why it happens, but the intensity of the action And and there being all the complete cause and conditions the conditions having all the complete conditions for the wrapping of the the result of the action is what determines, when the result of an action is experienced. So we can see we can see, for example, that some of our actions bring bring some results in this life. For example, we get our paycheck every month or so forth, which which is a result of our of our of our efforts, of our labors.
And there are other actions that that would only ripe in the next life and other actions that will ripen in life after the next, any any number of lifetimes after the next. Now precisely to know precisely why and how it works is is only Buddha and no one, obviously. We it depends on having all the conditions gathered. And those conditions, Geshe-la was gonna say, they are innumerable. So it’s like, again, like like like planting a flower.
There’s a of things. At first, put the seed plant the seed of the flower in the soil, and, again, that seed doesn’t immediately turns into a flower. Again, we have to gather all the conditions. We have to gather nutrients and sunlight and water and so forth. And the flower will sprout and grow into a flower.
The seed will sprout and grow into a flower. So and and the same for karma, for actions. So, again, we need we need all all the causes and conditions complete for the ripening for the ripening of that seed. And, again, it has to be, again, of of a similar similar type, then again we do not get what we want. So as maybe similar type of wisdom, which they have to be they have to be they to conform.
Those those causing conditions, they have to conform with with with the flower, in that the the the cause and conditions have to be favorable for the arise of the flower. They have to be beneficial for the growth of the flower and so forth. Instead being conditions that that stop the flower from growing or sprouting and so forth. So, again, we need we need for example, for for the for the sprout sprouting of the seed, we need we need to put water. Right?
The that’s that’s seed that sprout, we need we need we need water. We need water. No. No. We cannot put boiling water on it.
Otherwise, it’s gonna it’s gonna hurt it. So What would have thought that the action itself would be the cause for conducive conditions for the results to flourish, flourish, mature? Sorry? The the the action you saw the action itself, I I would have thought that that in itself is the cause for conducive conditions for its results to Is the seed the cause of the water, the sunlight, and the soil, and the nutrients? No.
Exactly. But I don’t see that that analogy actually holds with all what I was saying. But that’s what he’s saying. So the the causes like the seeds and everything else that is being added to the seed, the the the water, the sunlight, the nutrients, and so forth, they are conditions. There are many conditions.
Technically speaking, So if it is a cause So if you think in terms of the flower, if it is a cause of the flower, it is not necessarily a condition because the seed which contains the potency for flower, the potential for flower, is the main cause. Was the other conditions or not? So if it is a cause of the flower, it’s not necessarily a condition. But if it is a condition of the flower, it can also be said to be necessarily a cause of the flower. So so the seed is the main cause, but the one thing that has a potency to to to become a flower.
And everything else conditions which are necessary for the the seed to sprout and grow into a flower. Everything else, which is a favorable condition, a conducive condition. Is that alright? Oh, well, I understand the that’s a metaphor. I I understand that it doesn’t quite satisfy.
I have perhaps I haven’t expressed precisely. I’ll have to think about it more clearly because I’ll just get the same answer back. Well, because the way the way you put it in English is that the the cause Yes. I’m I’m probably choosing the wrong words, Rodrigo. So I’ll think about it more, come up with a clearer And then, Geshe-la wasn’t saying this is is yes.
For virtues and non virtues. And, again, if it is a non virtue, again, we need one needs many, to accumulate many nonvirtues, many causes. Geshe-la was saying it’s not it’s not it is not the case that we have one result arising specifically from one cause. It’s it’s it’s a whole collection of causes and conditions that bring this this this cake, which is the result. Cake was my my work, my addition.
If I didn’t perform an action, virtuous among virtuous, later, what did I just say? If you didn’t perform if you didn’t perform an action, which was did the virtuous or non virtuous, which is then the neutral action. You’ve experienced a neutral result. So then the result, if you have performed an action which is neither virtue nor non virtue, then the result is an experience which is neither painful nor pleasurable, neither happiness nor suffering. The previous moments of of those of those conditions are their own causes.
For me, did you experience the conditions that I don’t want to drop it. Gotta stop. It’s a lovely topic. People’s as well, wouldn’t they? Mhmm.
It’s gonna be very interrelated. I’m trying to think. Did are you trying to suggest that that that Me or You you are you I’m just trying to figure out what you’re what you’re trying to say. That would be helpful for me. Yeah.
Yeah. Are you trying to suggest that as as he was saying he was saying in one hand that all the conditions are created by all of us. Are you trying to say that you I, myself, I’m creating I’m the source of all the causes and all the conditions. Is that what you’re trying to say? Like my actions.
My actions are the causes causes For those conditions to arise so that the fruition of the original action occurs. So they so so this is really this so my actions are because I’ll I’ll try to. Oh, this is okay. I’m just happy to I’m happy to do that. I’m just I’m just focusing on the text and and having to translate English into Tibetan.
This is it was giving me a headache. This is This isn’t? This is more pleasant. So let’s see what we can do. Was insane.
Every moment. Right? Six years of a finger snap. We are creating karma. Right?
We have this. So there are these all these innumerable, really innumerable, countless causes that we are creating. Now Geshe-la was saying, so every one of those karmas, every one of those actions is has the potency of generating a result result of similar type to itself. Right? And, also, every one of those actions works as a as a helper for other causes.
So all those actions, they are causes in and of themselves of of something which is of similar type, a result which is of similar type to them. And they are also conditions of other causes. And they are innumerable, countless. And the way the permutations are infinite. The way that you have so many causes with so many conditions or one cause with so many conditions or many causes with one condition.
You know, you have infinite permutations. Does that help? Yes. You very much. Yeah.
Say that again? Experiencing suffering Experiencing suffering? Is a step towards It’s necessary towards developing renunciation. Renunciation. But it’s is it how we react to that experience of suffering that’s actually the action that is the, you know, that is the actual condition?
So we can react with it with attachment or with aversion. And so that’s actually the the act of that’s the action is the attachment or aversion to the suffering. It’s not the suffering. So the suffering, like in the analogy of the flower growing, the experience is just like leaves falling as the flower is growing. It’s not actually it’s not definition of the flower growing.
No. So it’s not it’s not it’s just a part it’s just a part of the flower growing. It’s not the seed, and it’s not the condition. Experience of suffering is just a byproduct. It’s about outcome.
But it’s how we react to it that’s the critical thing in terms of it being conditioned. Right? I’m not sure. Condition of? Of what?
Of creating an effect in the future. Sure. No. I understood what I was thinking about it, and now I’m not communicating very well. Very well.
So, essentially, just what’s important about suffering. That’s what I’m trying to get at. Like, what’s is it how we react to it that is the important thing in terms of development of our positive potential? I’ll see if I how I can Yeah. Sorry.
I’m not Oh, don’t be sorry. I I you’re not doing anything wrong. I’m just a bit dizzy, but it’s all good. I’m telling you the stretch. I still have one, you know.
Kursa. I I just mean, how do we what so do we want to cultivate positive actions? We want to connect virtue. So where does suffering fit in that picture? Where does our Because suffering is is part of our lives.
So is it is it our reaction to that suffering that is the important thing in terms of ongoing nature? Yeah. My difficulty here is is in translating the the idea of reaction, which is only my fault. But So so what what occurred to me in the flesh, which I lost the track already, is that the the the distinction might not be you might not have a clear idea that that was in saying, so, yeah, we need suffering in order to be able to develop renunciation. And the idea is, I mean, you have to you have to experience suffering so that you can experience you can develop the the wish to be free from suffering.
And you need to develop you need to then gain an understanding of what is suffering, what are the causes of suffering, and then develop a wish to be free from that. Now as for what is suffering, we have we have these three types of suffering. We have the suffering of suffering, which is the obvious pains and and and and that we experience and and the unpleasant experience that we have, you know, flus and colds and headaches and all that. But then we have also the suffering of change and this and the all pervasive compounded suffering, which are which are things that we actually do not perceive as suffering. We actually hold them to be pleasurable and happiness.
And then, moreover, you know, the all-pervasive compounded suffering. Is everything here that you see that was born out of contaminated actions and the afflictions, our bodies, our thoughts, our feelings, every object here, every everything in our environment is suffering. Is that helping? So and and the and the source of all these three types of suffering is is ignorance. Is not.
And you’re setting up. Is that okay? Mhmm. Do you want to read the dedications? Dedications for you.