Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. In this 82-minute afternoon session from a Kālacakra initiation retreat, Ven Thubten Dondrub guides students through a detailed philosophical commentary on anger and patience. Working from verse 25 onward, he systematically establishes that all harmful actions and suffering arise entirely from causes and conditions—not from independent will or choice. The teaching traces how anger itself has no inherent agency; beings who harm us are overpowered by afflictive emotions and therefore worthy of compassion rather than blame. Dondrub then explores how even antidotes and objects of abandonment are empty of inherent existence, and paradoxically, this emptiness is precisely what makes transformation possible. The session culminates in practical instruction: understanding that enemies and friends alike act from conditions allows one to remain mentally at ease while responding appropriately. A demanding teaching on emptiness and dependent arising, suitable for students already familiar with Kālacakra practice and Buddhist philosophy.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 18. Day 3 Teaching afternoon.mp3
UUID: 48a8baf4-d2b7-421f-b059-80850cb309ea
Teacher: Ven Thubten Dondrub
Collection: KI Retreat (Ven Thubten Dondrub)
Date: 2005 (exact day not recorded)
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 81.6 minutes
Words: ~3,896
So we we are getting to the what’s it? Third division, which is the conditions? All shortcomings arise from. So which is it’s a topic called all shortcomings all shortcomings arise from causes and conditions, so they are not independent. So well, I can’t find I can’t find which from which topic this is a division of.
Anyway, the the we go into the verse. The verse is number twenty five. The goes reads something like this. Whatever mistakes and the various kinds of negative deeds, they all arise by force of conditions. So they are not independent.
So Then Geshe-la went into the commentary to the commentary that goes something like this, whatever whatever thoughts of afflictive emotions and and whatever negative deeds that arise from them, whatever kinds all these all these various kinds of negativities that arise from them, they all they all come about by the force of causes and conditions. In the text, it says uses one word, and Geshe-la explains this word refers to both causes and conditions. So there is no one who has who is independent or who who has independence or who has power over oneself, it says in text. So so then So okay. Okay.
So, yeah, I’m asking him how to to say in English this certain word, and he’s he’s laughing. I don’t know English. So so so the text goes so that being so, there is no it is unreasonable for us to to get angry at the migrators, and then they they use they use a word, a compound word, this is. It’s like a it’s it’s making an analogy because it says that water can Geshe-la explains water can only go go down. Right?
And so the all these migrators also only go down from from higher migrations to to lower realms and and stuff. So how can we get angry at them at them? It’s not it’s not alright to do that. So having having thought over and over of all this having thought all these reasonings that we we went through up to now over and over, and then we we we have to put a put an end to to anger. So the then we we go into the next another division that that’s that which is which is which is their causes and conditions are also not independent.
It’s where is it? Your idea. Uh-huh. Of course, I’m gonna say also not independent, cultivating, refueling existence. Okay.
So I’m sorry, I lost track of the divisions. So anyway, this is a second division. One of the major divisions is called the causes and conditions are also not independent. And then we go into the next verse, following Stephen Batchelor’s translation here, because it’s a bit difficult, this verse. It goes something like this.
These conditions that are assembled together have no intention to produce anything, and neither does their product have the intention to be produced. So and Geshe-la goes on to explain that, for example, a person who who gets angry, I mean, he doesn’t think, oh, now I’m going to to get angry, and then and then anger comes about. You know? It doesn’t happen this way. And I’ll explain it again that it all depends on on the causes and conditions being complete, and then it will arise independent of this being’s will.
So then we went into the the commentary. Geshe-la is explaining that that that being so, So all all the all the conditions of being being being all the conditions for the arrival of of suffering and so that arises that that comes out of afflictive emotions and thoughts and so forth. Being all these conditions being complete, and then how to say? It doesn’t it doesn’t how to say? It is not up It is not up to oneself to to think or to wish may may this suffering arise.
So it it it depends on all the conditions for the arise of this suffering that comes from from afflictive emotions and so forth to to come about thus. So so in the same way that that is not up to a person, it’s not up to oneself to give rise to to anger. And then the the text goes goes further on to explain, and Gela went further on to explain that, for example, anger anger itself does not wish to give rise to suffering also. I mean, it’s just it’s just, again, it’s a matter of all the causes and conditions for for the arise of suffering to be complete, and then that that the suffering will come about. So, Okay.
This one. So then we we go on that that because of all that, thinking over through all these reasonings about the the being or the thing that causes oneself harm and going for all these reasonings, and then and Geshe-la explains all these reasons, what are they just like all these things and beings that causes harm, they come about through through the through causes and conditions. They are afflicted, and and afflictions lead them to negative to engage in negative deeds and so forth. So they all all of them, be they animated beings or inanimate beings, they are all how to say, impelled. They all arise out of cause and conditions.
Then so going through all these reasonings, then it is it is not it is unreasonable to to give rise to anger, thus. So now we get into another division. It goes this it goes it goes it goes like this, refuting the existence of independent causes. That refers that has, again, three topics. And the first two of these topics are the refuting the independent self and the principal substance of the Samkhyas, which was a non-Buddhist school that accepted an independent permanent self, posited an independent permanent self.
And then the second topic is refuting the independent self of the Naiyayikas, which is also a non-Buddhist school, but posited an independent self, another kind of independent self. So, Geshe-la says that this is a very difficult topic and would take a very, very long time to explain this. And so we skip these verses that are related to this. And we go to the third topic, to the final topic of this division, which is Okay. So we go to the the the third topic, which is understanding that all migrators are like emanations, it is unreasonable to get angry with them.
Okay? So then we go to Okay. Okay. Okay. So then we we get we got forward into the the commentary.
We are just one line before verse thirty one. This line is just introducing the topic, which is a topic that I just mentioned. Understand that all migrators are like emanations, it is unreasonable to get angry at them at them. So migrators, Geshe-la says, refers to all sentient beings, And then to their being being like emanations, it refers to the fact that they are how to say? That they are not independent.
That they are how to say? So, yeah, they are not independent, they are overpowered by causes and conditions. They arise out of causes and conditions. And then and so because because of this condition, existential condition that they have, they are like just apparitions, emanations, and so forth. That there’s no real essence to them.
And then and then, again, I’ll explain. So then that being so, there is no there’s it is it is it is there’s no no no it is senseless to get angry at them. This one. So so the then we get into the the next verse, which is in verse thirty one. And then so everything so it says So it says it says, therefore, everything is if I if I translate it literally to you, it says everything is other other powered.
And then Geshe-la explains, what is this other power? It refers to the fact that they that they do not have power over themselves, that they are overwhelmed by causes and conditions. Then the next line goes on to say, so because of Yeah. By the power of of of that, then then those do not have power over themselves. So that refers again to the to the causes and conditions, and then those would refer to all beings and things and phenomena that are not independent.
Then So, then the next line goes to say that knowing knowing this knowing this to be such, to be so, then we understand all phenomena to be like apparitions. Then the last line explains that then all things that there is and and then and then all things sorry. And then anger will not arise toward all things or any things. And then things here, it kinda explains it refers to everything, animate and inanimate again. So so the commentary goes to say that all the So every phenomena, action, activity that has a reason as an effect, all of them are underpowered, are are not independent.
So even the conditions, Geshe-la says, even the conditions Even if conditions arise out of out of causes and conditions that come from from a long time before, from a long from from a sequence of causing conditions that that goes far into the into the past. So even even the conditions arise in this manner. So So So every effect every effect does not have does not have the power to to give to give rise to itself or or to not give rise to itself. And then so they are all like illusions, and the text says, like illusions and apparitions. That is that.
Okay? So then the text goes goes on to say that every every everything, again, I can explain, thing here refers to all the animated and inanimate phenomena. Everything appears everything everything is is empty of being established from its own side. And knowing all all happenings, all phenomena, be them actions or things or whatever, to be to be this way, then they then we we like, the the all the things being like an illusion, we we do not get angry at them. So, Geshe-la explains Geshe-la is trying to explain to me that that all phenomena is that all phenomena they appear they they’re appearing to us indicates that they are not that they do not exist from their own side, that they are not inherent in existence.
So it’s just that yeah. It’s just it’s just that all all happenings, all actions and activities, they they how to say? They are like they they are empty of existing from their own side. They they are empty of being truly established phenomena. And then there is no there is no action or activity or happenings or phenomena in general that are established from their own side.
Yes. This one? So the text goes on to say that we have to study in order to realize, how to say, the lack of inherent existence and is the the lack of inherent existence and the interdependent nature of of of phenomena and in order in order to destroy the seeds of afflictions. So then Geshe-la says that we have to understand that all activities, all actions and phenomena and so forth are empty of being established from their own side. And then that’s what this line is referring to, that we have to understand this.
And then understanding this, we are realizing emptiness and then and giving putting an end to all afflictions. So then is explaining the the Tibetan expression that one part of the Tibetan expression that is translated as interdependent phenomena. In Tibetan, it will be just like interdependence. And then, Gela explains that this word refers to the fact that all phenomena arise out of causes and conditions. And then understanding that they arise out of causes and conditions, will be able to realize that they they are not established from their from their own side and then and realize emptiness in this fashion.
So then the verse is a little bit cryptic, and Geshe-la was explaining the verse to me. We got into already into the third division of cultivating patience intent on dharma. We got to the third division of that topic, which is opposing anger, the need to oppose anger. And we’re getting into that verse number thirty two. And then the first two lines, especially the first line is very difficult.
So it says, what what or who is there to oppose what? So then so Geshe-la says that this first the first what, it’s referring to to antidotes. And and the other what is referring to all the objects that that are to be abandoned. So so and then, yeah, so all the objects to be abandoned that are all the afflictions and so forth. And then the second line goes on to say, so it is not that it is unreasonable to to oppose to oppose to bring in any opposition.
It is unreasonable to bring any opposition. So then Geshe-la goes to explain further that when he’s talking about why why is he saying that in the verse, he’s saying what is there to oppose what? There is a it is unreasonable to bring to bring about any opposition because after having investigated the previous verses, and we’ve got to the conclusion that all the antidotes themselves, they are empty of being established from their own side, are empty of inherent existence, and then all the objects to be abandoned also are empty inherent existence. So then if both of them are empty of inherent existence, so what what is the use of of opposing one thing or another, you know, with with one thing with the other? So then the next two lines of the verse goes goes something like this.
So it goes it goes something like this. All suffering all suffering that depends. Okay. So all suffering all all all all suffering that depends on that, and then Gela says that refers to the fact of no. All suffering that exists in dependence on that, and that refers to the fact of of it refers to emptiness, non inherent existence.
Let’s say So So all this suffering that is empty of inherent existence can be discontinued. So it is not it is not unreasonable in the end to apply the the to oppose these things. Again, I explains that and again, furthermore explains that all these exactly because the the the objects to be abandoned and the and the antidotes, exactly because they are they lack inherent existence, and and that is exactly the reason that makes it possible for them to to stop makes it possible for one to stop the other. Because if if they were not if they didn’t they did not lack if they were if they existed inherently, then one wouldn’t be able to stop them. So then the commentary goes on to say that if there is a how do you say?
Not having not having not even a speck of dust of of inherent existence or or being established from its own side, whatever antidote and whatever object of abandonment to be abandoned, it is it is unreasonable to to apply any opposition to make up to make to bring up any opposition. So if if one says that, then Okay. Okay. So then the person who says that the person who says such a thing does not understand the meaning of of, how to say, emptiness of existing from its own side, emptiness of inherent existence, and then not knowing how to destroy this this to stop with these compounded activities, he he sees he apprehends the two truths, relative and ultimate truth, as being contradictory. So the objects of abandonment and the antidotes So, Geshe-la is saying that that person does not understand this phenomena to be empty of inherent existence, the meaning of being empty of inherent existence, so he sees the two truths as contradictory, he apprehends them as contradictory, and then that this person should is being unreasonable.
Okay. So that that this this person not not knowing this doesn’t know that, but in fact in how do say, the objects of abandonment and the antidotes, they are in fact empty of inherent existence and empty of existing from their own side, and that is not unreasonable. So and then the text goes on to say that they have objects of abandonment and the antidotes by being empty of existing from their own side, and then relying relying on the realization of this emptiness. How do you say? And then rely on that realization.
Those rely on that realization, then one will be able to to put a to put an end to anger and so forth, all all the afflictive emotions and thoughts. And then And that by that one, we’ll be able to put an end to to to discontinue the the flow of suffering. So then we get into the next verse, which is referring to the topic, which is the synopsis, which is a synopsis of the cultivating patient’s intent on dharma. So then it says it says something like, when I see an enemy or a friend engaging in an improper activity, then by thinking that such things by thinking that that those things arise from from conditions, then how do you say? Then I shall I will I will keep now I shall keep I shall remain in a happy state of mind.
So then, yeah, again, I just briefly explains that, okay, enemies refers to all those people that we dislike, and then friends would relate to refers to all their relatives and people and anyone that we like. And then how do say? While they are committing these negativities, and we know that they are dependent on causes and conditions and so forth, then we won’t give rise to anger. So we won’t experience this suffering state of mind, and we will remain in a in a happy state of mind. Okay.
So the guy like explaining is explaining the commentary, and then according to Genlath’s explanation of of the commentary itself, it will go something like this. Based on the on on those on those reasons that were given previously in the text, then when when one sees enemies or friends engaging in in how to say it? Senseless, how to say it, causing senseless harm to oneself or to others, then knowing that then we have we have to know we have to know that those beings, they are, how do you say, powerless, how do you say, They are they are afflicted afflicted by, how do you say, negative emotions and thoughts, and they are powerless in this condition. And and and as such, they arise they are they are coming about out of a collection of causes of sorry, collection of conditions. So and then thinking this way, then we can put an end to to anger, and we can prevent our our happy state of mind from deteriorating and just remain remaining in a happy state of mind, and then we can meditate on on patience.
We keep on meditating on patience. We have to meditate on patience. So then we got into the next verse, which is verse thirty four, and then it goes something like this. If things were brought were brought into being by choice, then because no one wishes suffering, suffering would not occur to any to any sentient being. And Gala explains that the first line is is referring is saying is saying that if if things do not depend on causes and conditions, and then and we we could we could we would have power to decide what we want to experience or not, then because we don’t nobody wishes to experience suffering because we all want happiness, then then these these things will not come about.
So Geshe-la is going again through the the commentary to this first, and then it’s the commentary says if if by if it happens that phenomena do not are not how to say are not dependent on conditions, then by the force of our own wish, of our own desires, we wouldn’t have to experience the effects, any effects. And then there will be no sentient being. By there being no sentient being who wishes who wants suffering, then there will be in the end no sentient being whatsoever who would experience suffering or yeah. Who would who would let suffering arise. But This one.
But but that’s but then okay. If if that was the case. Right? But then seeing seeing the arrival of of of suffering, then seeing how how suffering arises in in fact, then all then all the sentient beings. So and then seeing seeing that seeing how suffering arises, then then So seeing how seeing how suffering arises then is it is not alright.
It is unreasonable for for for for us to get angry at a sentient being who is who is powerless Mhmm. Who is helpless because because this anger and so forth, they are rising out of, how do say, afflictive emotions and so forth. So then we have to put effort in, I’d say, stopping afflictive emotions and so forth to arise. So if you have any questions. Are you tired?
Did you understand everything that was said? Still don’t understand thirty two. Thirty two? Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. So, guys, this is a very difficult subject. It’s emptiness, and it’s it’s very difficult. Yes. It says.
Just with thirty three. So when you see an enemy of being committing an improper action and you realize that they these actions are arising from conditions, is it I mean, should you be in a happy frame of mind? Wouldn’t it be sort of more compassionate or understanding? Like, you shouldn’t be happy that they’re committing some crime. No.
No. It’s just that what it means what it means in the text is just say that you won’t let you won’t let your mind be affected by it. It’s it’s just what it means. Right. Maybe yeah.
In the Tibetan, it’s well, it comes out in in many different ways in English. Your translation has that. There’s two here and one says ‘at ease’. Exactly. One says ‘happy’, ‘sight’, ‘because it’s ‘At ease’ sounds better.
It’s like you won’t let your mind be disturbed. If you were a bodhisattva and you saw someone hurting one another, shouldn’t you? You sort of have to jump in, don’t you? Well, the answer is that, yes, well, you should try to stop. Yeah.
A bodhisattva will try to stop. A bodhisattva would try to do anything that that would to benefit whatever would bring benefit to to other beings. Yes. His mind would be abiding would be at ease in this In this situation. Conflict situation.
He’s at ease in this present easy state of mind. Yes. Yes. It wouldn’t change into something else. Yes.
Oh, yeah. So we’ll finish with the prayers and then the teaching section, just the second section, page twenty four.