Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. A small child urinates on a ritual warning fire, scatters the protective stones, and the sick person inside recovers the next day — which his village took as proof he was an emanation body. In this 91-minute biographical interview from 1988, Khensur Rinpoche works through draft chapters of his life story with a biographer at Buddha House, clarifying details through a Tibetan translator. The conversation covers Chinese currency in his Kham homeland, village governance with rotating headmen, the Kālacakra-based Tibetan calendar and how intercalary months keep seasons aligned, Losar and the Monlam prayer festival, and Tibetan astrology — ending with a story of an expert astrologer who predicted his own death to the precise moment, pierced through the ear by a bamboo pen on a sudden gust of wind.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 34 RS 1988 11 10.mp3
UUID: f5fb3bf1-b39e-4a71-888d-41ffb9ce121b
Teacher: Khensur Rinpoche
Collection: Rinpoche's Story (Khensur Rinpoche)
Date: 1988-11-10
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 91.1 minutes
Words: ~4,632
Seven eight nine ten. This is Thursday this is Friday, the tenth of November nineteen eighty eight. I’m going to Buddha House to talk with Khensur Rinpoche with Dawa translating. So so far hasn’t got a clear idea about how far it everything is going. So maybe you are the one who has the idea of which parts are, at the moment, most important one to go over.
Right. So on that basis, you can just go over with two of your teams. Right. Well, if you just tell Rinpoche this beginning part because I’ve gone over it, and then Bruce has gone over with Rinpoche. This is merely final.
Mhmm. So if we Maybe if you could ask some time next week if he has time, say, an hour to come and have tea at our place, and I could just show him my little office Mhmm. And show him all the different stages that I have am going through on the story. He might like to give a blessing to my new little office too. Fix a day later.
So this first part, I’m reading from page four of my transcript, and you made a note about Further clarification might be needed from Rinpoche about the Chinese currencies. And you said I think this might have been exceptional case in border areas near China while the rest of Tibet traded or bartered in very very I don’t know I can’t read your writing with native Tibetan currencies. So Rinpoche is talking about Actual money was very precious. There wasn’t much currency around in my area. We didn’t have Tibetan currency.
We used Chinese currency. Previously the Tibetan currency was used, but then we began to use more and more of the Chinese currency until they weren’t using the Tibetan. There were many different types of Tibetan currency. The name was taken from the pictures which appeared on the currency. One of them was a picture of a person who didn’t have a collar.
I think Jampa had a bit of trouble translating this description. So they called this person this collarless Mhmm. Currency. That’s right. It was bigger than one inch.
Which river? Digi. Digi? Yeah. I think it’s Mecko.
Right. The area- Yeah. The area above, Digi River, has some sort of, come in a a a a a Of course, in the past, it was part of Tibet. Mhmm. But after Chinese attacked, and somehow Chinese captured these places.
Fifty years, hundred years, five hundred? Just roughly. Born in twenties. So looks like around nineteen fifteen. Right.
Good. I I could probably try checking that history book too. There’s one man here called Span. He’s got long hair, short, and he knows a lot about Chinese history. So when Rinpoche describes this person on one of the coins that was hunched over, that must be a Chinese person.
This one. This is hunch over. I mean, just that. I think so. So it’s called the bent one.
The bent one. The bent Yeah. And it’s a Chinese, of course. Must be one of the Chinese great person in the street. Oh, so some sort of bit bent and hunched, of course, but bit bent.
And let me just say this Chinese person, Chinese coin like English one. Yeah. So So you must be some old Chinese sage. Walking stick? But the Rinpoche says, at first, we didn’t have any actual currency, then slowly we began to use the coins.
He must mean the Chinese coins. And that’s in Rinpoche’s hometown. Right. Is it? I yes.
Yeah. Yeah. They’re not. They’re talking about different occupations in the village and customs for payment or renting animals and things like that for for journeys to from his village? Hong Kong.
Yes. Yes. When when people would make a journey to last, and they would lend them mules or something for the journey and how they would pay. And so if they didn’t have any Chinese coins before, I’m just interested in how they pay for everything or what is just, you know, how it works without money. Also, things are given in return for borrowing, you know, tons for meals and horses, like money, tea, So up to page six, and it was just a spelling.
You Rinpoche has his mother’s brother, Jetsün Jampa. Perhaps if you could just ask him how he says Jensen Jampa’s name and if you we could get the spelling right. You said you can think of what I’ve got what I’ve got here is right. Then who? And normally, monk who come from a list of great family and able to sponsor or they are given special title called.
So that’s Because he came from an aristocratic family. Yeah. Or he can be able to sponsor So it’s the kind of monk who, in monastery, sponsors the monks with their foods and facilities and Mhmm. Who are given this In the case of not being sponsored, have to be from rich families and who can be, what, called source of emergency help for the monastery to which they belong host to. And they are given the time, and they don’t have to work too too much like the other monks in monastery’s labor and things like that.
So it’s a kind of title giving to specific monks who can have the monastery financially as his monastery. Oh, I see. So did Rinpoche’s uncle, Jetsün Jampa, did he actually spend much time in the monastery or more time in his home? So, firstly, he has to go to what I call he has to go to one of the three monasteries in central Tibet, and then come back to and then. So he was a monk for whole rest of his life.
Mhmm. Mhmm. Page eight. Just just to clarify a word. Mhmm.
This is this is the time when Rinpoche was a little boy. Mhmm. And the custom, if anyone was sick, they’d light a fire in the door and they put stones around. Rinpoche peed on the fire and put the fire out and the stones got dirty and he got rid of the stones and very soon after that the person got better. So that’s when they first realized that Rinpoche had some special powers.
But then Rinpoche says, everyone said, I must be a reincarnation of some great power — and power is not a very good word, so you’ve said, I think we need to check up the Tibetan of that. So how did everything start with this? So There was a custom Mhmm. That if somebody was sick in the house and a fire was lit at the doorway and stones were placed across the door, but then Rinpoche was only five or something, so he came along and he peed on the fire and put out the fire.
And this got the stones all dirty. So he got rid of the stones. And soon after this, the person who was sick got well. So everybody said, I must be a reincarnation of someone with some great power. So there’s a better way of putting that.
Normally in that area, there’s a custom when there was somebody sick in the house to to lead the fire at the door. Mhmm. And then along with that, next to it, to pile stones on top. Now, they’re like in Tibet, you made Oh, yeah. Single those piled stones.
Yeah. One on the top. So, this is to indicate why this is done is normally whenever there’s somebody sick in the house, and if you let all sort of people come in the room, then this in the case of ordinary people, whenever they can, that makes the person’s sickness get worse. So, in order not to let also people come in the house. This is a warning indication.
Oh. When there’s a sick person inside. Yeah. So when this is lit out to the door and the piled stones, then everybody knows, oh, there’s a sick person there. And with when there was this sick person inside and outside the fire, and she went there and peed on the fire and then dismantled the whole pile of stone.
And the next day, the person recovered, and then everybody said, Oh, he must be an emanation body. Oh. You know? An emanation body coming to serve sentient beings. So he’s not even this kid is not an ordinary one.
He must be an emanation body. Right. So Yeah. Did they say a particular emanation or just I think the two vehicles with someone. Let me say, So I’m to page nineteen, and we’re talking about the organization of the villages in Rinpoche’s home area.
Mhmm. And he’s saying in our village, there was a head person called. Mhmm. And we’ve got here means to correct, to collect. And then you’ve made a note.
Check this with Rinpoche. If it is, it means subdue and control. The word for collect is is a bit different. So we just need to find out that man’s name and what it means and what he exactly does again. I can’t write those in a printed English book.
So what do we do? The the best is o e’s. Uh-huh. Mhmm. D o e.
Yeah. And that means? Together. Collect. Together.
To collect. Yeah. Gather. Right. Gather Yeah.
They’re under under one’s control, under one’s rule. Right. Page twenty one. So we’re still talking about this head person. And it says the head person would often go to visit the Dzongpon who was in charge of the district.
And you’ve got a little note here that you haven’t heard of this word. It could be right, but it’s worth checking it again. So they elect a new headman every five years. Mhmm. And the head person would often go to visit the.
That’s the head of the whole district. So the village headman is one year term, you said it would be only? Yes. Think so.
This is what I understood. Yes. No. No. And I don’t know how long the we haven’t got much information on this other one, but he must be the hip.
I don’t know how long he stays. The the other one is called in the head or in who resides from this had he has so many under him, like, one in had Yeah. Only. Yeah. Yeah.
That’s one. And then on all directions. Oh. Yeah. So many others.
Oh, okay. And this wouldn’t be for the whole of come. This would only be for the small area of Kham, would it? What is What and and then what area is it? So this only is the one who covers the village.
But that place, which is called, and that’s a kind of what I call the residential residential or headquarter. And this has come into being because in the past, there must have been a leader to a leader. Uh-huh. And he’s really sure he’s continuing to control name not a name only Right. In that place.
Yeah. Now every work for about five years, the has to go there along with few representatives from other villages under that territory. Mhmm. And they only get there will be about three, four people. Alright.
And they’re all of equal rank, equal power. Uh-huh. So they constitute their own chief or what call highest authority controlling the whole area, and they have to remain there for five years for five years too. Yeah. And I asked what happens during this time in this village here.
Yeah. Says there doesn’t have to be any person in his place here because it’s so close. He can come back. They live there? So are you are you saying that there is one man as well as these three other isn’t.
There isn’t. That’s right. That’s where I’m going before. It it gives an impression. Yeah.
But it doesn’t. Oh, so they collectively? Yeah. That’s right. So you only stay there for one year at a time, is it?
No. No. Five. Five years. Yeah.
Five years. See, I’ve got here. Had a full time position which lasted one year. It’s not right. In that So in there, they remain for one, two years, depending how successful they were.
If they don’t, then they’re not successful, then they take leave in one or two years. Otherwise, they remain for some years. So that’s I need to clarify what’s times for exactly some time today too. When he was everywhere, some of the chapters were. But that’s so, anyway, that’s good.
There’s not one person, but it’s three or four people, and they live there. And they’re all close enough to go back Well, I’m gladly thank you for and there’s another question you’ve got here to check. We’re just talking about some anniversaries that they celebrate in their village. Mhmm. Do you want to do you want to just his name and the name of the place near last time where he was born.
That was a festival they celebrate. In that village. It’s not the birth anniversary. It is the passing away anniversary. Passing away?
Yeah. Of. Oh. And it falls on Tibetan twenty fourth of October, the twenty fourth of Tibetan tenth month.
Twenty fourth? Of Tibetan month. And it’s called literally the fourth offering. On tenth day Tibetan Day, which is the passing away anniversary of Tsongkhapa. Oh.
So both these are celebrated or, yeah, celebrated. This leads up to Yeah. Tsongkhapa’s passing. Yeah. I mean, the next day is Oh. I see.
And that’s called Ngachu. Yeah. Fifth one, fifth offering. Fifth offering. And the previous one is called fourth offering.
They’re referring they’re referring to twenty fourth offering and then fifth offering. So often when you say twenty fourth and twenty fifth, you just say four and five. You drop the the twenty. This is just in our special case. No.
I’m not. So in Tibetan, because Tibetan don’t specify three and third, or four and fourth, and five and fifth. So in Tibetan it sounds like three offering and four offering, but it should have in English it becomes very clear, Third or fourth offering and fifth offering. Some people think, oh, maybe on the previous day, you only make four offerings in the second year. Yeah.
It’s just referring to Yes. Twenty So they think, oh, it must be thirty different celebrations. But it actually means third of the tenth, oh, tenth of the third. Third, you know, tenth month. I see.
And we he just says there, this festival took place mainly to commemorate the defeat by the Buddha of the non Buddhists through his display of miraculous powers. Mhmm. So that is the fourth he’s talking about being The fourth. Or the fifth as well. I think it’s fifth.
That that what I call that time, our first year doesn’t fall in this time. Oh. It’s only in in Tibetan first month. And here, we’re talking tenth month. Oh, so this isn’t relevant to this at all.
No. Not at all. Right. Well gone through. Glad I checked.
Alright. So most of the monks from this area would go to Sera Monastery for studies, so that’s why they celebrated. So page twenty two, we’re talking about Losar. Mhmm. And does does a secular year begin with Losar?
Mhmm. We’ve got we’re talking about Losar, the new year, according to Tibetan calendar, is on the first day of the first month. Mhmm. Is that right? Mhmm.
There is no particular Buddhist calendar, but there is astrology according to Kalashakra. In the text on moral disciplines set up by the Buddha, it specifies certain days. These include when bimonthly confessions are to take place and the summer retreats but these days are worked out in accordance with the Tibetan calendar. There is a secular year and the Buddhist year. The secular year begins with Losar.
Saying that one is secular and that one is non secular. There isn’t. There isn’t any difference. Right. So twelve months making one year is and being based on that and being more based in Kālacakra system.
And in This is a regular Tibetan calendar? Various in that, there is an explanation which varies from the previous one. And that one, regarding when the year start, when the season start. In that one, it’s been different, but internal calendar is based on Kālacakra. And so it’s alright to say that the year begins with Losar.
That’s true, isn’t it? Mhmm. You just don’t say secular. Just say the year. Yeah.
That’s right. The general the media, that starts from first of January. Yeah. The the this is just for me to clarify in my head. Does the Monlam prayer festival start straight after Losar?
Does it go straight in from Losar to that? Oh, it starts from New Year from the fourth day because first three days are considered celebration of New Year. So that’s called Losar? What Losar. Yeah.
Losar literally means new year. So that would cover the first three days? Yeah. That’s for so first three days are celebrated as new year celebration. And then from the fourth day starts the Monlam festive prayer.
No. No. Is it all over Tibet or only in Lhasa? So it depends on various monasteries how long they do. Mhmm.
But in Lhasa, it starts from fourth and goes on twenty fifth to twenty sixth. That’s very long. First year. And it depends. Sometimes it could be started from fifth depending So maybe it’s fine to say a fourth.
Mhmm. Mhmm. But each year is a little bit different. Those days. Yeah.
So that’s saying remember what were saying, in we have one day missing, one day extra. Like, there could be fourth missing and then five extra or six extra. Yeah. So in those case, it’s just a calculation. And that happens sometimes whole month is missing.
Oh. Double month. Like, Tibetan time would be doubled in case of astrological calculation which comes that this month is doubled, and it happens double. And it’s very interesting that even it’s a winter double, the whole double month, even though it makes the winter longer in the paper, in actual fact, it happens. The winter is not.
Really? Yes. Yeah. So how long ahead do they calculate? The the the years then?
Only one or two years ahead? Actual what I’m calling general official way of announcing next year’s so next year’s calendar, it starts the official date is one, and when March one is announced and distributed in the calendars, then from March two, the government and all the departments, they plan according to how stars, moons, planets, elements will be at that particular day which they want to perform different activities. Many different kind of things whether whether it’s going to be good or not, when it the wind, wind, everything goes, how how their program has has to suit. Yeah. And also And they can do that from from this calculations.
They can check the weather and and Yeah. Is it based on Tibetan astrology? Oh, it’s a demand, based on Kālacakra tantra. And before Kālacakra Tantra was translated and used as astrological basis for today, whatever was before for when that’s that’s not very clear. It’s not sure what was being used.
Yeah. And the reason why it is being announced every year first of March is because that was the time Kālacakra Tantra came to Tibet, was brought to Tibet. Oh, first of March? First of March. Yeah.
The exact year is not in memory [unclear]. Mhmm. But still and that’s the date and month when Kālacakra came to Tibet. Was this a period before king Songtsen Gampo or after? The in the June.
Oh, So if it like in Western calendar, if it’s just let loose, like, every thirty, starts thirty first and then goes on like that, then the calendar doesn’t go in go in parallel with the outside condition of weather. And sometimes because of that, sometimes it happens on calendar, it’s summer. When it’s actually raining, it’s winter. When it’s winter, it’s summer. Whereas in the Tibetan calendar, the calendar calculation is based on outside factor of weather and seasonal changes.
So that’s why summer has to summer, winter has to winter, and spring spring, and each month is given three three months. Three spring, three summer, three winter, three autumn. Mhmm. Given three three. And every three year, there has to have one extra month.
If that one extra month does not happen every three year Mhmm. Years, then, you know, then the whole thing will change. Summer will be winter. Winter will be summer. So this still happens.
They they still work this out in Dharmasala every year? Every Yeah. That’s a short calendar. You wanna have a This one has nothing. It’s just like an ordinary calendar brought in in parallel with how Westerners would have.
So the Western calendar, Tibetan date, only date and nothing else. So when when like, for instance, with the Guru Pujas, they are worked out on the Tibetan calendar. That’s why they’re always different on our Western one. So this last year in Western Way, the year started on February the seventh. Mhmm.
But you would say first of January? Tibetan first of January. That the that’s last year. Anything do they have they all got Dharma names, or do the months have names the same? The the and the nature, you mean really, you know.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There And that’s the name according to moral discipline of Buddha. So tomorrow, this is my birthday, and I just wonder what that is in Tibetan, what day that would be.
Yes. It’s quite different. The ninth ninth Tibetan ninth twenty three. But it’ll vary every year, wouldn’t it? Yeah.
So that’s why the no Tibetan would ever calculate their birthday. No. It’s not like the Tibetan, like with Lama Tsongkhapa and those too. Yeah. And like so many other people.
But just in villages, we don’t keep record. Well, it’s not like that. It’s because parents don’t have interest Yeah. In the dates day bird. Yeah.
And that’s what they don’t know. Yeah. And whereas here in west, they think, oh, birthday is very good thing. That’s the only thing that they have in the west. They have nothing else here.
But see, all all the people here in Australia, all Aboriginal people, they don’t know. They don’t care. They don’t keep records. Keep If there was a bad bushfire, bad flood, or something special happened, then I remember, oh, yes. Little so and so was born just before that.
In Tibetan, we consider two things important. The day of the day of love breath and day of life. So love breath is kind of life’s Tibetan word. So because love breath. So this is meaning male.
Love breath. Did you say breath? Breath. Breath. Yeah.
So it’s Our last breath Yeah. Dying. No. No. It’s not dying.
It’s kind of just a word we haven’t got. Yeah. And its meaning is very op very obscure. Yeah. But the bread is causes mood.
Yeah. So meaning, we just say we have a breath day, day of the breath and day of the love. And day of breath is more or less like a person, what things would be more which day, which weather, which season, which year would be more in what I call which would suit him as a person according to his burden. And so sok sok sound, which is like a life day. Sok?
Yeah. That’s the second one. Life life. Yeah. So that’s like saying life day, you say?
Life day. Yeah. That’s like saying how long the person will live according to the estimated calculation. Rinpoche says because he hasn’t taken any interest in astrological studies, so he’s not very sure what exactly the two things are referring to and when the astrological significance is. I’m not quite clear.
I wanna ask more, but I know what to want. And who so does everyone have this calculated for them? If it does Someone just It may be a bit difficult to have the chart drawn in the case of person who doesn’t know his birthday. So yeah, in the end, we come back. You have to know your birthday.
Yeah. To that, according to astrological importance. If you know the birthday, then they can work it out what what is your birthday and what’s your life day. So life day, actually, is the breath planet. Which planet confirms with your breath and which planet confirms with your life?
And there are twenty seven planets. Uh-huh. And And so many, what I call, stars. Uh-huh. And I’m not really sure what the exact number is.
And then the astrology astrologist, they will work out the chart and can tell you which planet is your life planet, which planet is your bread planet, and which planet is your dead planet. Wow. And they can work out in the case if you know your birthday. Normally, in Tibetan, we say birth planet instead of birthday, birth planet. Like a Sunday Monday, we say planet or sun planet.
In there, there are only seven days or seven planets, but there are twenty seven planets. Mhmm. Through astrological chart, they can bring out exactly when are you going to die, what hour are you going to die. Not many people wanna know that. Maybe they do.
I don’t know. So it’s life, breath, and death. No. Life, planet, and death plan or breath, planet. But it’s just literally it’s still because it’s saying that it hasn’t studied.
It hasn’t got interest. Do you know about this? Oh, just literally, I think that’s the closest in Life. In translation. Yes.
I just don’t understand. No. It’s too too obscure what I call idea, and both can both when you explain, they both have almost same subtle meaning, both refers to one is in life, one is sustaining sustaining life power. That’s the life? Yeah.
Oh, more the same. And the breath? Yeah. Oh. Breath.
Yeah. No. You can also work on when you’re going to be where you’re going to be born after death. How the astrological calculation can work out? The exact pinpoint time of your dad is there’s a story of a person in the past, which I heard in different version.
Mhmm. So in that one, it seems more interesting. There was a person in the past who was a most expert astrological chart reader. Mhmm. And he worked out when he’s going to die, and it came out just right at the end.
He’s going to die at that very moment. Oh. And it’s going to die, but there’s nothing nothing obvious about his. His lab has no sickness. But at that time, his child writing pen, in those days, bamboo pen.
So he was just sitting there, a window open with with a bit of curtain fabric. And then somehow he felt pinchy inside, itchy. So he tried to do that. And then all of a sudden, there was a wind, which removed the fabric, and then left the ear — piercing it — and he died. What happened?
That’s extraordinary. That’s what I’m gonna do. Yes. Any what else do you want to add? Just a minute.
What’s the time? Eleven forty four. Is it alright? Just a few more things. Three more, but a few general things I want.