Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. Using dreamless sleep as a vivid analogy, Geshe Pema Tsering opens this 35-minute session by mapping the highest formless realm — the peak of cyclic existence, where discrimination ceases entirely — and explaining how practitioners of single-pointed concentration can be reborn there. He then flags a genuine doctrinal danger: meditators who confuse emptiness with nothingness risk rebirth in the realm of nothingness, trapped there for vast stretches of time with no clear sense of what comes next. Student questions then draw out a careful distinction between the three samsaric realms and Buddhist pure lands: unlike realms that arise from karma and afflictive emotions, pure lands like Amitābha’s arise through pure aspiration and are inhabited by Bodhisattvas and enlightened beings. Suited to practitioners engaged in systematic Abhidharma study.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 09 2006 10 26 M and MF (2).mp3
UUID: 5f558d7a-bded-4549-8832-46a04deb882a
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: Mind & Mental Factors (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2006-10-26
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 35.4 minutes
Words: ~2,497
So there is Geshe-la then gives you an example, an illustration, which will help us understand what happens. It’s just it is similar to when we fall, like, when we fall asleep. So then whilst we are falling asleep, there is still some traces of awareness of consciousness. But as at first, when we fall, when we actually fall asleep, there is no we there’s no awareness whatsoever for us. We do not discriminate anything.
So then, I guess, it’s not like when one dreams. It’s not the the the sleep we’ve dreamed. It’s like this the dreamless sleep. So it’s similar to that, and that’s an an illustration illustration of of this formless realm. And Geshe-la also then explains it also, one does not one is not born in in such realm of existence, how to say, randomly.
Randomly. One has one has to practice single point of concentration and aspire to that understanding that the lower concentrations practicing the meditations and teachings and teachings and teachings and teachings which refer to the to the inferiority of the lower concentrations and the superiority of such a higher concentration, and then thinking, oh, that’s that’s a good state to to be and so forth, appreciate the quiet of that state, and then practice the single point of concentration of that, and then when one dies, then one is born there. So having cultivated that, yes. Was, was you are there? Of with respect to which level that they are meditating on.
And then Geshe-la la is explaining there is a danger in Buddhist practice that one whilst one might be meditating upon emptiness, and one confuses it confuses emptiness with with with nothingness and and believes that nothing exists, then there is the the danger that or if one attains proficiency when one’s meditation once one is meditating this way, then one will be born in such a formless realm of nothingness. That’s one of them, the third one, which is the realm of nothingness. So there are some to get out of once you read it? The So then, yes, it is it is is very dangerous because, yes, once born in such a a formless realm of existence, one stayed there for a very long time, and one has not a clue why one was going to be born after that. Yes.
Basically, yes. It’s very dangerous. What did you have explained before? It sounds I didn’t understand. You know what?
In case you want to explain to us before. What was he explaining to us before? With respect to what? When Geshe-la was explained about the you know, it’s like sleeping. That was that was an example.
That was an illustration. It is not the actual thing. There was an illustration of what happens in the in the formless realm, in the the highest of the formless realms of existence. I mean, formless realm sounds like sleeping. No?
It is similar in that sense that there is there is no discrimination. There was this is highest of the formless realms, which is called the peak of cyclic existence. And Geshe-la was explaining in this realm, this realm is not mentioned here in the text because there is no discrimination whatsoever in this text in in this realm of existence. And then Geshe-la was explaining that this not they’re not being discrimination. It is like what happens when we fall asleep into a deep dreamless sleep.
We do we are not aware of it. We do not discriminate. We do not have discrimination in that in a similar way, that’s what happens in this higher realm of concentrations. Is that realm still part of cyclic existence. Yes.
It means saṃsāra. Samsāra. Yes. Oh, okay. Very much.
Samsāra. One hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
So these last six things, are they mutually exclusive? Because it sort of seems like you could have an unreason or a reason discrimination while being in the small. You know what I mean? Because the I because it sort of looked like the last four were talking about sort of different stages of resistance and realms, but I don’t know how the reasoned and unreasoned sort of fit in with that idea. With the other?
Yeah. Do you know? Can you be reasoned and in the yeah. I guess I guess it makes sense. Where is the Tibetan?
Because you have a unreasoned consciousness. Well Yeah. Yeah. That’s more reasoned consciousness. Good question.
Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Let me just find the Tibetan. I can’t remember the Tibetan word for that.
Gee. What is this? What is this? So I I’m I’m trying to to think of a way to to put better your question, because I was just explaining that we are we have those those concentrations, these discriminations of of the small. And we have also this unreasoned and reasoned discriminations.
Discriminations. We do not have the others. But if I was then saying that we we have all of them or at the same time, I was then saying that we have all of them, but we have not attended these concentrations. So then so that I was I was asking him, is there a chance that by by means of unreasoned discrimination that we somebody might be born because of that, might be born in the in the formless. Formless.
So then I was asked, is is there a chance of someone being being end ending up in the formless realm by by by because because of of a non reason discrimination? And he said, no. This this doesn’t happen. In order to be born in the formless realm, one one that involves the attainment of higher concentration absorptions, involves the attainment of of calm abiding and so forth, it’s very difficult to do that, and those are higher attainments. So then so then one one having already attained calm abiding and not having a clear understanding understanding of emptiness, then one might then incur the danger of being born in such a place or in such a realm of existence.
So then so then yes. Then and then again, in this that person who has attained calm abiding and who has not has not a clear understanding of emptiness, then that that might be the case that a person has an unreasoned discrimination. So then so then, yeah, so then the person has attained, binding, has attained special insight, has not does not understand emptiness, has not taken refuge, and so forth. So then it might be born in such a place. We we do we we do not fear being born in such places because none of us have attained calm abiding.
Yeah. Oh, yes. So then every has every has this omnipresent mental factors, even insects and the like. So then every sentient me of the four of form and the desire realm of existence, yes, all of them, all sentient beings who have consciousness have that. And We have these one to five that we discussed.
Yes. And includes intention, which we we discussed the intention. So I mean Yeah. Some intention. Yes.
That’s that’s what Geshe-la just said. I mean but not not all beings of the formless realm would have those, and particularly the the beings of the peak of cyclic existence, they wouldn’t have just said they didn’t have discrimination. They wouldn’t have any. Yeah. They wouldn’t have any any of those.
Okay. This is an interesting point. But every consciousness, like I said, every consciousness has this. Fine. Okay? There’s no There’s no answer.
You have a computer Even even my question is simply even formless realm is, you know, part of the cyclic existence, but Four absorptions. Four absorptions. Four absorptions. Absorptions. The formless realm.
So I guess I was explaining. So then there is no there is no Buddha realm. There’s no Buddha realm? No. The realms, they are all samsaric.
I would say, they are all within saṃsāra. The formless realm, the form realm, and the desired realm, they only exist in saṃsāra. Not there’s no Buddha realm. Pure land. So then even the pure lands, they are not not within cyclic existence, and one would not use this word this word to refer to them.
Realm. But then we might use it in English depending on the if you contextualize, you can use it in But the word come, which is the Tibetan come, which has been translated here as as realm, which is the correct translation for that. In English, it was used and has been used in with different meanings in different contexts. It has been used to refer us to the pure realms of existence and to pure lands, pure fields. And I guess I was explaining, but this come come, this this word in Tibetan makes reference to only the three realms of cyclic existence, which is the formless, the form, and the desire realm.
So when when hero asked, is that a Buddha realm? And then I use this word that Geshe-la was using in this teaching today. And Geshe-la says, no. There’s nothing like that because come realm is something which is within cyclic existence. And Buddhas are free from cyclic existence.
They’re beyond cyclic existence. Right? Okay? So then there are the three realms of existence of cyclic existence. So there is the desire realm.
Say the word realm? Yes. Yeah. And then within the desire realm, we have the six classes of beings. So we have hell, hungry ghosts, animals, humans, demigods, and gods of the desire realm.
And then you have the form realm, and then you have the first the four form concentrations, one to first concentration, the second concentration, the third concentration, the fourth concentration, that’s their name, even in Tibet. And then you have the form formless realms of existence, and I have their names here. So then, which are first, the realm of infinite space, then infinite consciousness, then the realm of nothingness, and lastly, the the peak of cyclic existence. And those are the formless realms. And this is what is referred to by realms, by come, that word come.
Come come is the Tibetan word. Yeah. The Tibetan word. Come. Okay?
You know? Yeah. No. No. I mean, mean, not really.
No. You haven’t met him. Right? So then, for example, in the case of Amitābha’s pure land. Okay?
So then such such a pure land. Okay? It is called in Tibetan pure field. Okay? Also also translated as Buddha field.
And then such such a pure land is not does not has not arisen out of actions and afflictive conceptions and emotions. And then Geshe-la was explaining. So then come realm is something which has arisen out of actions and afflictive conceptions and emotions. And such a pure land has not arisen because of that. Yeah.
It one is born there out of having made pure aspirational prayers and having practiced great virtues, and only Bodhisattvas and enlightened beings and and also Bodhisattvas and enlightened beings abide in such places. And all are not, how to say, free from actions and afflictive emotions, conceptions, or whatever. Yeah. All of it. Come.
Come. Come. Come. That’s the main No. So then the three realms of existence, the three realms of existence, they they all arise out of actions and afflictive conceptions and emotions.
That, you know, you I mean, art. So realm in terms of area or domain or territory or or in in in my language, brown, we write as a realm. Realm. Okay. In my language.
So we have the form realm, form realm, that is a term which is same. But in in my language, also Buddha realm, but we use the same, you know, writings as a realm. Okay. In English also, you do the same, but not in Tibetan? No.
And is explaining. So then a realm in this context is something which has arisen out of karma and afflictive emotions or conceptions. A place, a being, phenomena which has arising out of karma and afflictive conceptions and emotions. That’s here in this context, in the Tibetan, come, that’s what it means. I guess.
I mean, I guess so. I don’t know. Japanese. I guess. Mhmm.
Bother around, certainly not not this. I have here. I have said. Yep. Yep.
Thank you. Cool. And then even even in Tibet, and Geshe-la was explaining, there are the same word can have different meanings in different context, in different areas of study. It will it might refer to the fields of apprehension of a sense power or a sense consciousness or and so forth. But in this context of this class today, Ram makes reference to only those those phenomena which has arising.
Actually, We all have. Just one last question, Geshe-la. Śākyamūni Buddha I forgot the name in English, but it’s the same realm where where where Maitreya is right now, the realm. The land of joy of I forgot the rest of them. The land of joy So then in Spanish, then every Buddha, every fully enlightened Buddha has I’m sorry.
I cannot remember the name again for this other term, which refers again to a Buddha field that says that the the fully enlightened Buddha, such as Śākyamūni Buddha, got enlightened first in a in a in a pure land, which is called in Tibetan, which is known known by no other. This is a transliteration. I forgot the actual name of the Sanskrit term. But then so then every Buddha will have its own pure land.
This long this own his own pure land, which is below none other. And then Śākyamūni Buddha then who was enlightened in in in in Bodh Gaya, in the vajra seat in in Bodh Gaya, then he came from one particular his own particular his own particular Pure Land, which is then Ganden, which is the the land of of joy. I forgot the rest of the name. The land of joy. There’s there’s a big there’s a very famous prayer of Lama Tsongkhapa for for this one.
For Ganden. But, yeah, where Maitreya is now, where the Buddha Maitreya is the regent of this period right now. And then yeah. That And then Geshe-la was then also saying that whatever whatever the Buddha goes, then that place is his pure land also. So then if the Buddha were to come here, that will be his pure land also.
It will become his pure land. But we cannot see. Those who can see, perceive that, they are they are other beings, noble beings. If if if if we were to attain to the level of higher being, noble being, then we would perceive this as as a pure land, a Buddha pure land. But we do not we do not.
No. We do not have this knowledge, do we?