Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. In this 44-minute talk, Ven Robina Courtin uses the analogy of a perfect holiday—one where you could be asked to leave at any moment—to reframe our relationship with life and impermanence. She walks through three contemplations: death is certain, the timing unknown, and only virtue matters when consciousness leaves the body. Rather than causing despair, this recognition should motivate full appreciation of our rare, precious conditions. She then unpacks the Buddhist view of karma and consciousness as non-physical and beginningless, before applying these teachings practically through questions about suffering, medicine, and how to handle difficulties like cancer as karmic purification. An extended Q&A addresses skepticism about reincarnation and free will. Pitched at practitioners encountering these foundational ideas.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 06 2002 01 19 BYT.mp3
UUID: 8a54c8ae-ff07-4b9a-85cf-2a6b6dc730a5
Teacher: Ven Robina Courtin
Collection: y Be Your Own Therapist (Ven Robina Courtin)
Date: 2002-01-19
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 44.1 minutes
Words: ~8,040
Feels it’s as if I do know when I’m going to die because I have no sense of urgency about it, because the reality is, and this is logic, you know, if I really do not know when I will die we can speculate but it’s not facts we’re dealing with speculation is not facts if I really don’t know when I’m gonna die then it does follow doesn’t it that I could die today it’s logic But who thinks this? Not one single one of us, I bet! Because why? Because Buddha says we have this deeply held misconception this one of permanent me, grasping at permanent me because that’s our fantasy! That’s our huge wish, you know?
Because the thought of not being me is too horrible so we cling so strongly to this sense of a permanent me and we have made it now our truth we have made it our truth we believe it really is the truth and we never question. So for me, a really good analogy is like when you go on a holiday. So first of all, we tend to think, well if I think I’m you know, there’s a feeling in this very strong that says, well, if I’m impermanent and if I could die today, well then what’s the point of life? Why I just give up now, you know? Well that’s not the point at all, it’s ridiculous.
Just like, you know, if you do go on a holiday, you know perfectly well it’s only you’re gonna say for two weeks. You plan for it the whole year, you analyze it, you check it out, you work out exactly the place you want to go, what it looks like, how much it costs, what it will be like when you get there, what you’ll do every day. Then you anticipate it all, and you’re ready for it, you’re really ready for your holiday, then you get there, and then from the second you arrive, especially if it’s a gorgeous place, there’s such a delight, isn’t there? In using every moment, why? Because it’s only two weeks!
You don’t say What’s the point of a holiday, it’s only two weeks, how depressing! You don’t ever say that! But we tend to have this feeling of life, you know, it’s like it’s this permanent holiday, but we don’t ever think it’s going to end! So really the best way to think of it is like you imagine going on a holiday to the best place in the everything is available to you but the condition is that they can tell you to leave anytime they like. Now can you imagine you wouldn’t even want to sleep just in case the next morning they tell you that you have to leave.
You got to get up day and night you’re going to have twenty four hours around the clock using everything possible in that holiday. Mean you get my point here, especially if it’s a really delicious one. Well Buddha is saying we have this very delicious life right now, these unbelievable conditions that are so rare, you know. We have a health, and reasonable wealth, and reasonable sanity, and reasonable good environment, and reasonable politics that makes the place reasonably stable, and reasonably nice, not totally polluted water and things and food. In fact we have an astonishing, if we look in this country, every time I come back to this country it blows my mind, you know, one of the nicest places on this earth.
With all the different things taking into consideration politics, environment, people, you know, so many things, unbelievable. This is all due to our past karma, which we will talk about. So therefore something not to be wasted, something to be appreciated and something to be used. So not only that, we’ve got this reasonable health and wealth, reasonable sanity, all the bits in one, all the bits in the right places, you know? The brain is still working.
All this is due to our good karma. Not only that, because we have all these conditions we also are able to access, you know, these aspirations that we all possess. These aspirations to want to somehow make more of this life, we kind of feel this is why we’re sitting in this room right now, because we do feel there’s something more to life than merely eating, sleeping and going to the toilet. That’s why we’re here, you know, And we all have these aspirations, and Buddha says we have these aspirations because there is more. Because we have this amazing potential.
So all these conditions is what this perfect human rebirth is, and we’ve got it. And then when we think about death and impermanence, it increases hugely, and we should not waste this precious thing. So this is the idea of this, you know like the perfect human rebirth is like this ideal holiday. And it’s like you’ve got it, but you know it’s our own karma that determines how long it is not God or Buddha. But using the analogy of the holiday is a good one for the mind, really sets you up.
That you’ve got this delicious holiday, as long as you’re on condition that you can be told to leave anytime, anytime, anytime from the second the moment we arrive. Can you imagine? You’d be on tenterhooks the whole time, you wouldn’t want to waste a single day, you’d never forget for a moment, would you? That they might have to tell you to leave in a minute, so I better do this, I better do this, I better go there, and I better have this. You wouldn’t just sit back and space out and then have a mental breakdown when they tell you to go.
Well that’s what’s happening to us. It’s like life is forever, as if it’s the truth, although it’s staring us in our face that it’s not true. We don’t have a clue when we’re going to die, we act as if we are really certain we won’t die today, even though we then say I don’t know when I will die, but I definitely won’t die today or tomorrow or next week we say or even next year. You check how we feel, you know? But what logic do we have to prove it?
We have statistics that prove sort of these objective realities, you know? But objective realities aren’t personal. Plenty of five year olds and ten year olds and twenty year olds and healthy people die all the time. And you look, you know, right now, look at the logic we use instinctively. We’ve got to analyze it.
The logic we use to prove that I’m not a dying person, for example. You check. Well, one of the logics is that I’m not old. Well, just look at the figures to prove that young people die, you know? Another logic another logical reason we use in our mind instinctively for why I’m not a dying person is that I’m that I’m healthy.
Excuse me, always think of Princess Diana with her gorgeous thirty six year old aerobic body. She was very healthy. Dead as a doornail, right? Doesn’t prove. Health has nothing to do with it.
The other one that’s even the most ephemeral of all, the logical reason we tend to use for why I’m not a dying person is that I feel good. Mean, I think Mrs. Diana felt really good that day. She thought it would stop death, didn’t it? It’s not meant to be emotional, are facts, know.
So we’ve got to use whatever reasons we can to jolt our mind from its misconceptions into be in sync with how reality is in order to give us energy to not waste this precious life. We have worked so hard to get. This is the idea, this is the thinking, you know. Now we hear these words now and we can probably hear that they are true. This is not meant to be religious ideas shoved down our throat.
We can hear these words are true. But only when we hear them when we read them do they come to our mind. The rest of the time the default mode of grasping at permanent me just comes back into full force, doesn’t it? So by meditating about it in this way and I’m talking in this analytical way, by thinking this through every day, don’t be surprised, you start to this shift in your mind. You start to actually get energy to use your life because you really do know you’re impermanent and death could come at any time.
So don’t waste this precious life. This what comes from this type of meditating this type of thinking so the third way the third point to contemplate first is death is definite second is the time of death is uncertain the third point is that at the time of death what’s important? That’s a very good question, you know. So, of course, Buddhism has its own ideas. So, given the assumption that your consciousness didn’t begin at conception and won’t end at death, first of all, given that.
Given that whatever you say do and think necessarily this is the view of karma necessarily leaves imprints or seeds in your consciousness that will necessarily ripen as whatever your future experiences are after your mind leaves this body. There’s no other determining factor. That’s your karma. Given that all your negative actions of body, speech, and mind, the ones that come from, you know, the ego part of us unhappiness and anger and delusion and depression and anxiety and all the rest will necessarily ripen as suffering experiences in the future. And given that the virtuous karma the stuff that’s coming coming from love and kindness and patience and all the rest that that will ripen as happiness in the future.
And finally given that we don’t want suffering and do want happiness, given these series of assumptions it is logical, isn’t it? Isn’t it? That at the time of death the only thing that’s important is the virtuous imprints in your mind from what you have done positive in that life. There is nothing else that’s of any value. Your body definitely of no use to you.
That beautiful body becomes kaput, doesn’t it? Your wealth, your family. You know in this life when people ask what the purpose of life is, majority answer that I observe when I hear it is family and health. Well it’s clear, at the time of death your family and your health are useless, at that time, are useless to you, they cannot help. Which is the point of being, you know, what the value of something is, is it useful to you?
Well at the time of death they are not useful. They’re burdens actually, especially if you’ve attached to them, that’s the point. Your reputation, how people see you, your house, your possessions, the whole thing that all the things that even if we’re not greedy grasping people, all the things that we assume now are of value some kind of intrinsic value is what I’m saying but they clearly don’t have intrinsic value there’s obvious family have value health has all these things are important but we don’t take but it’s all kind of they’re all contextual aren’t they? You’ve to understand in reference to what are they valuable so in terms of you know being happy now yes health and family are very important But in terms of the time of death, which is this in Buddhist terms is crucial transition point from this life to another one. This is a Buddhist idea.
Given this, then at that time, health, family, wealth all the things that we consider of value do not have value so then clearly logically they don’t have intrinsic value they are relatively valuable yes definite no problem but the Buddhist approach is you don’t have to chuck your family out don’t chuck your wealth out don’t chuck your health out you just have to shift your attitude towards it that’s all and that is to say in relation to your family your wealth, your health your this your that you as long as you can create virtue and not create non virtue then you will have good imprints in your mind that will are the only thing that I’ve been used to at the time of death because they then will rot their seeds that when the consciousness leaves this body and goes and you know and I’ll discuss the death process goes you know in this transition period between lives and then due to karma finds its new womb it’ll be a womb that you’re happy with and a life that you’ll be happy with when you come out Just in the same way you plan for your holiday, in the same way you plan for everything.
Remember reading in Time magazine recently, maybe a year ago, I don’t know, in America. And the man who wrote the introduction he probably wasn’t a Buddhist but it was a very good point he made, he said that in the West we’re talking about America, we plan for everything except our death. Plan for our coffin, we plan for what prayers are going do when you’re dead. We plan for even the wake, people plan for everything, even the concept of the death as if it’s sort of something to do with his life. But not the actual death process itself, not actually where my consciousness will be when it leaves his body, which is what death is all about.
We don’t plan for that. Okay. Because we say, well, no one knows what’s gonna happen, so what’s the point? Know? But mainly it’s because we would rather live in this ignorance of it because we don’t want to think about it.
Because it’s too painful for us. Know? What happens to be the Buddhist approach is it’s very necessary to think about it. And as you can see, you know, it’s what’s being stressed. And indeed in Buddhism too, there are these very detailed precise teachings of exactly what happens and how and so on and so forth, which we’ll talk about.
But what we’re talking about here, more than anything, is the attitude towards it to shift the view we have in the mind very deep now that clings to this permanent me and lives in this la la land of, you know, of fantasy that is not helpful to us and is the basis of so much fear, you know I remember in California there’s a friend who’s a Buddhist who works in the hospice movement and she says it’s an accepted thing and people perhaps here work. Said it’s just a given in the hospice movement that everybody dies with fear. She said except people who’ve got a spiritual path. And feeling is that’s because they’re the only people who think about death that’s all not even because they’re right in what they think I’m not even saying Buddhism is right but it’s because if think about death, you think about anything and analyze it and check it out you won’t have fear when it comes it’s just logical you know I mean can you imagine if you didn’t if you never thought about your driving test and never learned to drive because you just oh well I’ll handle it when it comes you say which is how we talk about death when it just comes it’ll be okay you know excuse me you’ll be a wreck and you’ll make a mess as well.
It’ll be a disaster. So we all know we’ve got a plan for anything that’s gonna come in the future if you don’t know yet how to do it. It’s just logic. Any questions so far about anything I’ve talked about so far? Yeah.
That’s what being a Buddhist means. How you live by being a Buddhist is what you do by doing what and I’m presenting each point as it goes along that’s the point and how you plan for your death is by this point we’re going to get to in two you know three points to three points or so is by abiding by the laws of karma That’s exactly how you do it. Is that what you meant? Absolutely. That’s the point of being here.
Definitely. Any questions about death or anything? What practice you’re talking about? So what do you see as practice then? What level of practice you’re talking about?
No, understand your point but the As in living this life, like saying, being motivated and having to practice Right, and why do you want to be motivated to practice? Why? Yes. I’m talking here, I’m giving the classic big picture, you know. I’m not saying you have to have it, it’s interesting because all these points that are presented in the way I’m discussing them here are in the context of continuity of consciousness which isn’t completely invalidated this is the point you’re asking, I know that, but that’s why I’m getting you to say to me well if you don’t accept the view of, know, for the moment let’s say, view of reincarnation is not comfortable for your mind so you can’t think of your consciousness from before therefore the one of perfect human rebirth could be valid for you because you can see that you’ve got a reasonable rebirth but you haven’t got a logical reason why in terms of reincarnation let’s say and then let’s say you haven’t got the view that when you die your consciousness might continue so then you’re talking about this period while you’re living here in this life and this person is you so okay then you practice.
So then within that context what’s practice for you? Why are you sitting here? Think about this thing. Okay. And that means what?
What do you think? How do you define that? Just to be more virtuous. And why would you want to be more virtuous? Because of karma.
But you don’t accept karma? You don’t accept reincarnation? I sort of accept karma but Just in this life? So you have the feeling that karma means if you do good things now in this life, good things will come? Oh yeah, well not in a selfish way.
What about a Tibetan Lama who’s practiced really really hard and there he is in prison being tortured for thirty years? He’s been very virtuous but look at his life! Wouldn’t that throw all your arguments out the window? If you become a really good person and then you get chucked into prison and tortured for thirty years. Anyway, that’s the kind of thinking isn’t it?
That’s the kind of thinking you are doing anyway. But this is the idea. Obviously within you, put it like this isn’t it? Because most of us don’t think about reincarnation, I mean a lot of us do these days, it’s interesting isn’t but it’s obvious that whatever it is that motivates you, you’re sitting here to be motivated to do something better for some and that’s good, already fantastic, you know? So that’s what Buddhism is demanding, we really look at it like this, which is what you’re doing, look at it more deeply, where does all this come from, why do have these, you know, did your mother teach you this, did your mother show you Buddhism?
No, she didn’t, but you’re bumping into it, and sort of certain ideas seem reasonable to you so all we can do is keep looking and thinking and analyzing, you know? So as for the one of reincarnation, but like I said last time, I can’t remember one single second of a previous life, no way! But the very first step before you can have an experience of something like an E=MC2 sounds such simple words a five year old can say it but in order to have the direct awareness of what that means experientially you have to do years and years and years of all the theoretical work, don’t you? So that’s really what being a Buddhist is for most of us at this point we have to start conceptually and if something, if E does really equal, you know, if E does really equals MC squared, whatever it even means, I haven’t got a clue if it is really pointing to the truth, let’s say you’ve got to have all the words and the theories to be coherent first, to be very coherent and even conceptually you should get excited about it, it should make sense. So what I’m saying for myself, I can say by this point in my life, having thought about what the mind is, how it is in physical, and thinking deeply in many many ways, trying to show yourself some kind of sense that that must be true, that I don’t come for Mum and Dad because if I did it would mean it would be this, and this, and this you try to use this type of thinking, at least then for me, and then thinking about karma on the basis of this and then all the experiences I see and I have and I look at other people and understand this and try to work out why this, why that, why war, why blah blah blah and then I relate it to all karma Well, for me, all I can say is so far, intellectually, it’s fairly coherent.
Experientially, I haven’t got it yet. But intellectually, so far I’m content. But it’s coherent. And it’s about, I can say from my own mind, that karma and the consciousness of being non physical and all this business, is about is the least is the most reasonable view I can come up with so far, that seems to work intellectually even. And that’s not don’t put that down, that’s fantastic, you know.
So, in other words, all we can keep doing is just thinking, trying to analyze, trying to see the what Buddha would say is the inherent contradictions In the view that your mind is physical, that your mind is created by God or Buddha, that your mind comes from mommy, daddy. Buddha would point out just numbers and numbers of just inherent contradictions in all those things, you know. That’s up to us, that’s the thinking to do, isn’t it? Probably that’s what the thinking you are doing, right? Slowly slowly.
That’s exactly right. Slowly slowly. Yep, exactly. Someone else have a question? Yes.
But as soon as you say if it is beginningless you don’t ask the question why it is. I understand. It’s interesting how all our minds you’re saying basically it seems to kind of we seem to have this strong what I’m hearing you say is we have this strong wish to know why something why or where is the first moment there has to be first moment or why do I exist isn’t it? That’s what you’re saying? Not necessarily I No what are you saying Everybody’s karma, everybody’s collective karma, everybody’s consciousness I’m going to repeat for the tape I should be doing this I’m sorry go on No that’s fine so what’s your roughly what’s your doubt?
To what the belief is to, why that is. What Buddhism is thinking? Okay. Alright. Well, seems to me the different views in the world.
They’re either the physical views, which is the materialist one, which we call science, right? Isn’t it? And we see everything is physically based. Right? You agree?
Okay. Then there’s another views which are mostly the religious views that talk about God or Creator. Almost all religions have that view. You agree? And all those religions will talk about in different ways of talking, you know, will talk about that whatever that is, that energy, God, whatever, is something that permanent and has always been.
It is beginningless, isn’t it? Now, know as a Christian, as a Catholic, it is not appropriate to question that. I’m not being rude, that’s fine, I’m not complaining about that, but one doesn’t ask that question. I remember even, interestingly, even recently I heard Stephen Hawking had a meeting with the Pope, I don’t know how long ago it was, and again I’m not criticising, I’m just looking at the different views, and the Pope apparently praised him and thanked him for all the work he’s done on discovering the nature of the universe from the first moment of the universe, the so called Big Bang but he said don’t go beyond that, that’s God’s job, not yours I’m not criticizing, but that’s the Christian view one way of putting it, okay? Now, the Buddha’s view is, first of all, it is our job because Buddha says there are superior beings, there is Buddha who is an enlightened energy, full infinite wisdom, infinite compassion, complete omniscience, infinite quality, consciousness pervading the universe, knowing everything, loving everybody, that’s God as far as I’m concerned, but the difference is in Buddhism, you can become it, I can become it, he can become it, and that is not the creative energy.
So, the creative energy, if you want to use that term creative energy, it’s not the term Buddhism would use, but I’m using it because we relate to it, is karma. And so that exists, that occurs in your consciousness, in my consciousness, in the consciousness of an ant, in every living being’s consciousness, this process of karma is playing itself out, and that is the creative energy according to Buddha, and that exists consciousness. So what’s consciousness? Okay, it’s hard to talk about something that doesn’t that you can’t see, taste, touch or smell because that’s the environment we occupy at the moment, is a sensory environment, right? So it’s hard for us to conceive of something that doesn’t that is existing but isn’t physical.
So, first of all, that’s what Christians would say the soul is, and it comes from God. Buddhism says that’s consciousness, that’s mind, in every level of your mind, deluded, positive, negative, doesn’t matter, it’s not physical, can’t be seen, touched, taste or smelt. It isn’t created, it doesn’t come from mom and dad, can’t come from nothing. I mean, just analyze anything that exists in this universe that we know about, anything at all, we immediately know that as soon as you posit that it does exist, we know it has to have been it’s the result of a previous cause Would you agree with that? Cups, glasses, universes themselves I mean, okay, that’s maybe the big point about the universe I don’t know what the big bang people say I don’t know what the Stephen Hawkings of the world say but the Buddhist view as the Dalai Lama said and I pointed it out last time BIG BANG, no problem!
Just not the first big bang, that’s all! So in Buddhism they even talk about this very now gross example a gross simple way of saying even the universe itself of course it began, everything begins somewhere but it’s got to come from something it’s obvious so Christians say it comes from God not complaining Buddhism doesn’t say that so what does the universe come from? Well the universe the way they talk about it and sort of the way they talk in terms of the four you know? Okay, Western scientists now have all these other names like quarks and atoms and all these different words for the energy that exists is more subtle no doubt but still nevertheless the Buddha’s view is earth, air, fire, water whatever and so the energy of the earth of your body and of the earth is the same energy earth air fire water of the body, right? So the beginning of this universe is they talk about a very subtle wind energy that had the latent possibility of the Earth, air, fire, water of this particular shape and form so, the time of the beginning of this universe, whenever it was the Big Bang, whatever, there was this very subtle energy that had come from previous universes and it’s just sitting there latent somehow, it’s just talking now and then due to the karma, the collective karma of all the billions of beings who will occupy this universe it begins to develop into the universe it’s not Mother Nature, it’s not God, not Buddha not accident, not random, not merely physical this physical energy in Buddhist terms couldn’t possibly do what it does unless it had the energy of karma which is the creative principle determining it but not in this sort of schizophrenic external way of somebody determining, Yeah, you do that!
Not like that. It’s a natural law, Buddha says. So, karma is the principle that determines our experiences, and we’re going to talk about it. So this, and where it exists is in this consciousness. So the consciousness itself.
If your consciousness exists now, we know it comes from a previous moment, we know that. It’s like a chain, it’s like a series of chains, links in a chain. And you can’t ever get to the first link. It’s not possible, it’s inconceivably impossible, because if you can posit: there is the first moment of my mind. We’ve established, as I say for the sake of argument here, not God, not Buddha, not Mummy, not deity, not physical, the only other option is, there’s no other option that you can even conceive of!
That it has to have come from a previous moment of itself! So if you posit that was the first moment, you can’t, you have to assume the previous moment. It’s chicken and egg, you know? So excuse me, how can you posit a first chicken? It has to have come from an egg.
Consciousness is beginningless. Intellectually, it is quite coherent if you analyse it. Emotionally, it’s an outrageous idea, we resist it, most interestingly. Does that help? It gives you food for thought, yes?
Well, all you can do is think about it, nothing else you can do, you can’t eat it. You can’t ignore it, you’ve got to think about it. This is the way to think. Yes? Any more questions on that one?
What’s What’s nothing? Is that something that’s opposite to something? Well, tell me, in a simple way, don’t get too complicated here. Nothing means nothing, dear. It’s an abstract concept because you can’t point out nothing, can you?
Obviously it’s the opposite to something, and all that exists is something, nothing doesn’t exist, how ridiculous! You can’t point to nothing! Nothing is just a word we refer to for something that doesn’t exist. So conclusion, there is nothing. Of course you can’t point to it, it’s abstract, isn’t it?
So we know if something exists it has to have come from a previous moment that was existing. And then that has to have come from a previous moment of something that was existing, and so on and so forth. Universes are beginningless, beings are beginningless, bodies are beginningless, consciousnesses are beginningless, It follows logically. If you posit God, I agree, then you can say universes and beings became, you know, created by God. But God is beginningless.
So that’s how the Christians handle that one. Buddha just says everything is beginningless, if you like, or consciousness, because consciousness is the creator of everything eventually. It manifests, it’s coming from everything. We’ll talk about more of this. Is consciousness personal?
You mean when you’re reincarnating? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely personal. You could say it like this that when you’re a Buddha and she’s a Buddha and I’m a Buddha we all come, let’s say we’ve all achieved our natural state of perfection, which Buddha says we can, then you would say like this, consciousness, your consciousness will pervade wherever there is existence, your consciousness will be wherever there is. There could be no atom of space where your consciousness isn’t. Because finally, how can something that isn’t physical be confined by space or time or matter?
It only is now because we have all these deluded egos and our consciousness is about as big as a pinhead stuck in our body, you know? But eventually when you free it up, when you go beyond ego, it is literally pervading the universe. Like, you know, when I was a Catholic I think God is everywhere. Was a very nice side, I like that very much, you know. Your consciousness will be everywhere, so will mine.
You will know everything, so will mine. She will know everything. So we won’t kind of bump into each other at that point. Yours might as well be mine by that point. You can actually even just say there is one Buddha.
There’s no contradiction. Because your consciousness mind will be knowing the same, having the same amount of compassion, we will all pervade the universe. It’s like we you know it’s not like this concept of kind of cosmic consciousness that we merge into it’s not quite like that but when we are in Samsāra as Buddha puts it when we’re not a Buddha yet when we are we are indeed all these separate beings There’s you and there’s me and there’s enemies and friends and this and that. This is dualistic universe that our delusions have created. But it’s not our true nature.
So, relatively speaking, yes, because of this, there are individual consciousnesses, and indeed, you create the causes to become your own Buddha and me too but we are it’s sort of like we’re individual until then if you like sort of the way of saying it and that therefore whatever you do say or think goes into your river of consciousness and whatever I say do or think goes into my river Okay, that’s just No, understand. Yeah, of course. That’s a very got a very particular meaning and we’ll go into that more later but I’ll just say a little bit here now. First of all, it’s really important to understand historically the context of that term and that is at the time Buddha appeared, he was a Hindu, so Buddhism grew out of that. The historical context is India, Hindu India, and the other traditions available then.
And so basically the way Buddha talked was always in reference to what was existing. And so naturally he is coming up with a certain philosophical view that is referred to in general as emptiness, which we’ll discuss, right? And another term for that is not self. Because why he is saying that is because the term in Hindu isn’t so much the term soul, but it’s self. There is some inherent, unique, independent, unchangeable, uncaused self or soul that does exist.
And Buddhism is arguing philosophically with that point. He’s not saying there is no you. It’s just the term of the use of the term self is many ways of referring to It doesn’t mean literally the way we use it. We’ll go more about that later. This interesting point the main the Buddhist view is the main we’ll go on about this too the main cause I should be repeating these questions you can’t pick up questions on the tape can you?
Have you noticed them? Please you keep reminding me. Otherwise it’s very frustrating when people listen to the tapes all they can hear is my silly answers and no questions you know. So okay this person has cancer, has had cancer. You said had.
It means you’re better now. Okay so then she’s saying what the Buddha’s view then in relation to whether medicine is effective or not? What do you really want to know how it’s effective? How can medicine be effective? If it’s due to karma yeah?
I understand all the karma. So if she gets cancer back what’s that due to? The ineffectiveness of medicine or is that due to her karma? Well the Buddha’s view is that the main cause, the main creator, put it like that, but not in the sense of magic wand or God. Please hear the word right.
The main cause of everything any living being experiences is the karma. The main cause, the seed of it is the cause. So in general, in general, okay, we’ll go into more detail when we discuss karma. That’ll be this afternoon even this morning. In general, would you agree that having your body suddenly have cancerous cells and speed up towards death is not what’s called happiness it’s called suffering isn’t it?
Would you agree? Would you agree with that? Initially. No you can do something with it can’t you? Why we do something with this because we want to change it.
Okay so therefore in general the most simple level we know that what’s called suffering is when the life is short, when it’s painful, when people harm us, we call that suffering, right? And what happiness is the opposite. Okay, so whatever we label suffering, Buddha says, is the result of having harmed others in one way or another in the past. And so generally speaking ill health is one of the karmic results of having killed in the past. Because killing is you know, and karma ripens in various ways which we’ll talk about very extreme and some mild you know.
And one of the karmic results we call it, it’s all the stuff, it’s experiences similar to the cause. So obviously one of those of killing is to be killed. Another one is to die young. Another one is to be sick. So that’s the main cause.
Number one. Number two: it’s clear we are all interdependent with all the things around us. So it’s obvious, it’s not just you in isolation having thoughts and feelings, everything is dependent. There are certain external factors that will hinder or help us. So you can say the main cause of why a person died is their past killing but the cooperative cause is they choked on their chocolate.
Do you see? So that’s the external condition that brought that karma to fruition. So for you whatever the external cause was that activated that past karma and then indeed you can also have the karma which clearly you have experienced when you have certain external conditions, they can help the situation and they can turn the cancer around. Well, that’s due to your good karma. So, you know, some people can get sick and then can get better.
Some people get sick and can’t get better. It’s just because the karma is very strong to experience a certain thing. Some people might smoke cigarettes until they’re ninety and never get cancer. So that’s because they’ve got very strong good karma that keeps them alive. No matter how many cigarettes they have, their body withstands.
Do you see my point? So karma is the main cause, and that’s the reason, you know, it’s simple to say it, I thought I’ll go into more detail, how come you can have all these anomalies, if some people can smoke till they’re ninety, and some people can smoke for two years and die. So it’s clear, we’d have to see, we can’t say cigarettes are the only cause of suffering. We can all see this because there’s always exceptions. And the Buddhist view is karma, you know.
If you were to die young does that negate your past karma? How do you mean by that? Yes. Oh I see. Yeah, I understand your point.
So, you get a better life next time. No, no, absolutely. Okay, another way of saying about karma, again we’ll talk about it in more detail, is that you can say, okay, you can purify karma, which means use it up or get rid of it just like seeds you can pull them out can’t you? Or you can grow them and make them even stronger so you know the way to increase negative karma is by increasing your bad seeds by doing bad things And then to purify karma you pull out the bad seeds and you do the good things. So a simplest level of purification is another of purifying is when you use up, when the fruit ripens, when that fruit ripens that’s the end of that seed isn’t it?
Is this how they talk in growing things, people who are gardeners? Every time a seed ripens into a fruit, that seed is finished, isn’t it? Yes, yes. Okay, so then that’s karma. You’ve just finished that bunch of karma by having this cancer.
So hooray, hooray, three cheers, that is purified. Then if someone dies, same thing, hooray hooray! That is purified! Okay, we might not say hooray because it’s our dear friend. But that’s the logic, every time you use up that karma.
This is interesting, it reminds me when I was in a conference in Florida a few years ago and there was a rabbi and me and a couple of Christians and the topic was why do bad things happen to good people? Well of course it’s perfect for a Buddhist, it’s karma, you know? What was interesting, the rabbi clapped me and he thought it was great because he also thought the same thing because he’s a what’s the word? I always forget. No, esoteric Judaism.
Judaism. The Kabbalah, yeah. He was a Kabbalist. And I didn’t know this, I never heard it, I think most of the Jews in the audience had never heard it. That the Kabbalists talk about karma, they don’t use that term because it’s Sanskrit, but basically he was saying the same thing, that we have this view of karma, reincarnation of karma, you know.
And as he said, they have a saying that every time something bad happens or someone is mean to you, they steal your money, great! That’s one less debt I have to repay! So that’s the logic of karma, you give it, you just use it up. So that’s a key approach in a certain level of practice that’s very strongly expressed which we’ll talk more about in the third scope, it’s said to be the most advanced of transforming problems. Learning, as Lama Zopa says, to like your problems like you like ice cream.
Right? And this is the logical reason. Because you’re finishing your karma. How fantastic. This is why it would demand I mean, for a person like this who yet doesn’t have a view really comfortable about reincarnation that there’s no way you can be happy about that.
Suffering is suffering. But if you have this context of using it up it’s going to bring more happiness in the future then you must have a view that it’s okay. We can help you handle it. The skin for the next karma in there how I handle my situation which I have to feel the karma Absolutely. Oh absolutely.
So let’s just say, know, punch you in the nose, which is your negative karma. Oh pardon? Thank you very much. Thank you, so good. Keep doing it.
So what she asked basically is, you know, does that kind of now I forget, God, I was just about to answer it, I had the answer already, now I forgot the question. Say your question again and I’ll repeat it. When the disease you have, when there’s cancer, yeah. Is that the end of the karma? Yes.
In how I handle that? Yes. Okay, very good. So the way you handle your cancer, let’s say you accept it and use it in a very positive way, that help your positive karma in the future basically? Yes.
Oh absolutely, no question, yes, no question, absolutely positive, fantastic. Let’s put it like this, let’s say I punch you in the nose. So first of all that’s the result of your karma, number Number two, the usual one is because you get angry now, you punch me back, right? So we keep the ball rolling, you just keep it all rolling, you know? Whereas if you don’t punch me back and you forgive me, not only have you purified that karma that you just experienced, you just purified a whole ocean of other karmas by all that strong virtue of letting go and accepting and forgiving.
So you’ve completely stopped the negative karma and you’ve created a bunch of good karma as well. Best. Fantastic. I understand. Yeah.
And you get the spiral up. Uh-huh. Spiral. Okay. Basically, you’re saying if you to a certain level of development, how can you possibly go back?
That’s the essence of it. Well, wouldn’t. The point is, Buddha is saying that you have to get to a certain level and specifically that is, and we’ll discuss it all, when you get to the level of realization that they refer to as nirvana which is really a state of mind when you’ve really accomplished the recognition of reality, you’ve really cut the roots of Samsāra, you’ve cut the roots of delusions. When you’ve done that, then honey, there’s no possible to go back. But anywhere up to that, and already Buddhism is saying, this is where the Buddhist view, that we have had in past lives, Buddhism would say, extraordinary levels of spiritual realization.
Clairvoyance, amazing powers, extraordinary levels of bliss, all sorts of experiences, but we haven’t yet cut the root of Samsāra, which is actually very subtle. We haven’t actually finally removed the seed of ignorance. So, that’s what I was talking about, remember what you’re referring to now, certain levels of rebirth called the God realms, which are eons and eons of bliss. That is the result of extraordinary virtue, but you haven’t yet gone to the subtlest level of removing these subtle imprints. So, while you’re having all that bliss, the subtle imprints are just latent.
There’s no recognition of them, they’re very, very subtle, but you haven’t removed them yet. And because you haven’t removed them yet, you’re still within the cycle of saṃsāra, you’re still creating negative and good karma, you’re just using up all that virtue you created, and it all eventually run out, and boom, your seeds will ripen again. But once you go to the point where you’ve achieved nirvana, where you’ve gone beyond that, you’ve realized emptiness and really cut all those seeds out, then never can you fall back. So it’s a question of And that’s where even in philosophical discussion between various religions, you can discuss where is the point when you’ve achieved the final goal. And that is, you know, in these terms exactly is how they discuss, you know.
I mean, for example, Buddhism is not meant to be sectarian. Buddhism would assert that the God realms is what Christians and Muslims call paradise or heaven and they say that’s the final goal. Well, Buddhism say no, it’s not. So that’s just discussion between you. Does that make sense?
Okay. Yeah. Yes. Understand. Whether it’s a physical overcome.
Yep. Yes, I understand. Yep. How do you choose? Yes, understand.
Good point. He’s saying that basically you know karma seems to be a determinist thing to him. So in that sense where’s the virtue? If you’ve got the karmic imprint to respond with a punch, you’ve got the karmic imprint to get your cancer better, you’ve got the karmic imprint to not respond, then where’s the virtue in this? It’s determinist.
I understand your point, an excellent point, thank you. We’re talking about karma now whether we like it or not, aren’t we? I keep saying it with karma, I’m trying to make it in orderly ways, but I’ve given that out already. Never mind. Yeah, it’s really interesting.