Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. In this 66-minute commentary, Geshe Pema Tsering opens with a striking question: can an arhat — who has completely abandoned self-grasping — still experience headaches? Drawing on Vinaya scriptures, he confirms that even foe destroyers must exhaust karma accumulated before liberation, since performed actions will ripen. He then works through several divisions of feeling: material versus nonmaterial (pure or spiritual) feelings; eighteen types arising across six sense bases; and feelings divided by function — those that support attachment to the desire realm versus those that support emergence into the first concentration. A vivid illustration follows: attachment inflates the pleasure of a liked object beyond what it actually possesses, while aversion does the same with displeasure. The session closes by tracing how the three poisons — attachment, aversion, and ignorance — arise from pleasant, painful, and neutral feelings respectively. Suited to practitioners following a systematic Abhidharma curriculum.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 06 2006 10 06 M and MF.mp3
UUID: e7eed292-24fc-4eb4-be8e-556b3c48c564
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: Mind & Mental Factors (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2006-10-06
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 65.8 minutes
Words: ~4,234
Sorry. So Geshe-la’s then instructions to generate a good motivation, and then wishing to bring all sentient beings to the state of enlightenment. In order to accomplish that, understanding that one must attain enlightenment of oneself. In order to accomplish that, the enlightenment of oneself, one is now going to study minds and mental factors, and one is going to then adopt those mental factors which are virtue and linked to enlightenment, and one is going to abandon those mental factors which are non-virtue. Suffering that we experience, again, comes out of mental factors, and every every happiness we experience comes out of mental factors.
So then we have to then to learn and study many mental factors, but not only does not suffice to know them, we have to put we have to put our knowledge into practice. Okay? So then we are studying we’re still studying feelings. Is that too loud? We’re still studying feelings.
And then we just went through the division of six feelings, three mental feelings and then three physical feelings. And then now today we are introduced also to another division, which say that those six feelings, the three mental and the three physical, they can be they can be further divided into material feelings. What you have in your text, in the English text, is material feelings and nonmaterial feelings. That’s a word that I haven’t heard before. This translation could be mixed or confused or troubled feelings or the or unconfused, non mixed pure feelings, or spiritual, even spiritual feelings.
Okay? It can be translated in many different ways. So then and then we are told, and then we the text asks, so then what what is what are these material feelings or these confused feelings? And what are these nonmaterial feelings or these pure pure feelings or spiritual feelings? So then material feelings are those feelings which are concomitant with which we have a concomitant with grasping grasping to to the five contaminated aggregates.
Those are called, what is what you’re having your text, material feelings. Then then explain. So because we all we all have this this grasping towards the the five contaminated aggregates, so then our feelings are all material feelings. And then I was asking, so then when the word in Tibetan that that that is translated as grasping is the same word that they use in the twelve links dependent origination. And I was asking, is this the same the same grasping of the twelve links of dependent origination?
And Geshe-la was then saying, well, that’s grasping that used in the twelve links of dependent origination. It is just a general term that refers to all sorts of grasping. It refers also to attachment and lust and so forth. So just a general term that refers to everything that is grasping. There’s attachment and so forth, desire and so forth.
And then, as for this non material or unconfused or pure or even spiritual feelings, we are told that they are those feelings which are concomitant with the wisdom consciousness which directly realizes selflessness. And was explaining that that wisdom consciousness, which that realizes selflessness, no grasping, has no attachment to it. So it is then it is a pure, unconfused, and untroubled, or or no material. So then Geshe-la further explains that, again, those feelings which come which accompany this this consciousness, which that realizes selflessness or emptiness, then it is called, again, a nonmaterial or spiritual or pure feelings. And then, Geshe-la was explaining those that consciousness is not afflicted by afflictive emotions.
And then, again, that’s again, that’s why it is called nonmaterial or or spiritual or pure or whatever or what have you. Okay? And then so then we are told that that there is this feeling. If we say that there is a nonmaterial or a pure feeling of suffering to a being who has the wisdom conscious that the direct realizes selflessness. So then, yes, then how is it how is it possible that such a being has this feeling of suffering, of this painful feeling?
So then the text tells us that, yes, such beings do have these feelings. And then the text says there are many examples of such beings who have these experiences in the Vinaya scriptures, the scriptures on discipline, and that say that foe destroyers or arhats who have completely abandoned self grasping, they do experience headaches and so forth due to the ripening of of previous karma that they have committed. So such examples are shown in in the Vinaya scriptures. Okay? So then, Geshe-la is explaining, so then not only someone who has direct realization of emptiness, has this suffering feeling or this painful feeling, even called foe destroyer or arhat has this painful or suffering feelings.
And I guess I was explaining, so such a foe destroyer has completely abandoned all the the obscurations of afflictive conceptions and emotions, and he has even abandoned all the seeds of of of all the latencies of these obscurations of afflictive conceptions and emotions. But and and even though he doesn’t produce any more contaminated karma, he doesn’t produce any more conditioned activities, still he he has to experience the experience the the ripening results of actions that he has performed when he was an ordinary being, whilst he was an ordinary being. And then Geshe-la is then saying, quoting then, one of the four characteristics of karma is that it it doesn’t karma that has actions that has have been performed, then they will they will ripen. This one. Okay?
And then, further more we have division of feelings by means of its basis into six different feelings. So then you have feeling that arises from the contact of the gathering of eye sense power and so forth, and then feeling that arises, again, from from the contact of the gathering of of the nose, sense power, and so forth, and again the ear sense power, and then the tongue, and the body, and then again the mind. And I guess I was saying so then in terms of contact, when we’re talking about contact, we’re talking about contact depends on sense powers. So then, again, this makes reference to the basis, which is which was mentioned here. And then so so then those are the basis of of these feelings.
And then, again, for each one of them, you have for them for for with the eyes and power and and so forth. For each one of them, you have the three types of feelings, suffering feelings, pleasurable happy feelings, or neutral feelings. Okay? And then we are told that for each one of these six bases of feelings, are the three feelings for each one of them: the happy, the suffering and the neutral feelings, and then giving us a total of eighteen different types of feelings. And then the author is telling us that because he’s afraid of of of how do you say?
He’s afraid of saying too much. Exactly. He has afraid of saying too much by analyzing everything in in in in too much detail, all these feelings in too much detail. So he won’t he won’t go any he won’t go any further in this particular division of of the feelings. So then then Geshe-la then explained that the author is not going to set them forth here in the text for us, but they are.
So then and then the way that he would set forth is is just the way Geshe-la was just giving an example. So then it’s the feeling of of pleasure or happiness that arise again the from the aggregate from the contact upon the aggregation of visible form visible visible form, eye sense power, and and a visible in an eye consciousness. And, again, and and the the painful feeling that arises from the the contact upon the aggregation of, again, a visible a visible form, an eye sense power, and an consciousness. And, again, the neutral feeling that arises from the contact upon the aggregation of a visible form, an eye sense power, and an eye consciousness, and so forth and so forth and so forth. So that will be that will be the too many words that he’s avoiding, the author is avoiding.
So then And then Geshe-la is then giving an illustration how how is it that we would set forth in more detail each one of them. So then for to give an example, if the eye consciousness through the eye sense power then meets with an object of our liking, then because it is something that we do wish to meet with, then there is a feeling that comes from the contact with that object. And then, again, this is going to be because there is grasping involved, then it’s going to be a contaminated feeling of happiness or pleasure. Okay? And then again, when when when we have the the contact, the the feeling that comes from from the contact upon the aggregation, again, of an eye consciousness, eye sense power, and an undesirable form, or an unpleasant form, say, form, then there will come again the feeling of pain or suffering.
And again, in the case of a neutral feeling that comes together with the contact upon the aggregation, again, of an eye consciousness, an eye sense power, and a neutral object, which be then an object which is neither to our liking nor to our disliking, neither a pleasant or unpleasant object, then we that will come the feeling will come of that will be a neutral feeling. And then, again, Geshe-la was in saying making reference to to our our liking or disliking or or the object being being an object of liking or disliking. And then Geshe-la was then explained that the liking and disliking or or the cherishing or the non cherishing of the object refers also to to both attachment and aversion. So if it is if it is an object that we cherish or that we like, then then there is attachment. Attachment will will follow.
There’s attachment involved. And then if it is an object of of of dislike, and then there is there will be aversion involved. And then explained that the object itself, it has it has some measure of which is then which is will be the pleasure pleasurable aspect to it. Some measure of of a pleasure aspect to it. But because attachment and aversion are mistaken, erroneous consciousness consciousnesses, then they would when when our when our consciousness then how to say?
So then when when when our consciousness and then when when there is attachment then to the pleasure object, and then that that that consciousness of attachment will will give to that object a larger measure of pleasure to it than than than than what it actually has. You is it is it clear? I was then just gesturing with so the object has this this little, and then but our the attachment consciousness, which is mistaken, and this gives this much, you know, to that object. So then again, Geshe-la is then saying as Geshe-la said, okay. I’m gonna I forgot to mention one detail.
So Geshe-la was then saying, so then the object from its own side, Geshe-la was then saying, the object from its own side does not have any measure of pleasure or anything. And Geshe-la was then saying, there is a there is a tiny little bit to it. And then again, with the object of aversion, with with the object of which or a displeasurable displeasurable object. And then Geshe-la was said again that there is nothing of of displeasurable to to the object itself. And it’s, again, rectified and said, there’s a tiny little bit.
But, again, the the the consciousness of aversion then puts much more to it, gives much more to it than what it actually has. And then again, with respect to the neutral feelings, because it is neither pleasurable nor displeasurable, and then the conscious is not aware of actually of of actually whatever measure of of neutrality there is to the object. It’s not how to say this? So then, I guess, I was gonna say, so then because it’s not aware of it, so it doesn’t it doesn’t give to the object any more doesn’t impute to the object more pleasure than it has. It doesn’t impute to the object more displeasure than it has.
It is not aware I’m missing the words. So then and then again, so then because it doesn’t do this doesn’t give more pleasure or more displeasure to the object than what it has because it doesn’t it’s not really aware of of the the situation or the or the the the condition of of of the feeling. So then, again, it doesn’t impute any suffering or happiness to the object. Okay? And then, again, Similarly,.
And in the same way that that that we can set set these feelings for for the eye consciousness and eye sense power, then in the same in the same the same applies for all the sense consciousness, again, for the nose and the ear up to the to the mental mental consciousness. Then there is this pleasure pleasurable objects, displeasurable objects, and neutral objects, and so forth, and feelings and so forth. So then then then we have eighteen feelings. Is that okay? So then we have eighteen feelings. And then and then again, so then the text, I guess, the text is telling that there are feelings when we divide in this way, but he won’t go into much detail. And then the text goes on to introduce then feelings can be further divided with respect to its how to say the objects of abandonment and antidotes, or in relation to objects of abandonment and antidotes. And then we are giving them feelings of a basis of attachment, or feelings that support attachment. That’s a better translation, feelings that support attachment.
And then feelings that support How do you say that? Emergence? Emergence, that’s that’s the the word we have in English, isn’t it? Or deliverance. Okay.
Deliverance will do. And then we are told that those feelings that support attachment or support desire, they are the feelings that are concomitant with grasping to the pleasurable aspects of the desire realm. Then, if I was explaining, those pleasurable aspects of the desire realm, there are all those things that we want to meet with, that we want to have, and that we do not wish to be separated from. So then there is attachment to it, and then again, all those feelings that arise with this consciousness, then they are called the feelings that support attachment or desire. Okay?
And then we are told that as for the feelings as for the feelings that support emergence or or or deliverance, then we are told that those are the feelings, for example, that arise, that are concomitant with with a with a mental consciousness, which is within the first one, which a mental consciousness that has turned away from attachment to the pleasures of the desire realm, pleasurable things of the desire realm, and then is it is included within the first concentration, for example. And then, Geshe-la was then briefly explaining that there were there is a word that that a couple of words that say that this mental consciousness is included within desire realm, and and it is important to to mention that it is included within the desire realm because the pleasure, feelings of a mental consciousness, if you just say feelings of mental consciousness, then this mental consciousness are also within the desire realm. So we’re talking about feelings of mental consciousness that are included in the in the first concentration only. Okay. And then explaining.
So then, again, making with respect to to the the the the part of the sentence, which says that it is a it is a mental consciousness which is included within the first concentration. Okay? The the the basis or the ground of the first first concentration. So then it is as the beginning of the Tibetan sentence mentions, it is a it is a consciousness that has turned away from attachment to the objects of the desire realm. And then that is to say, so then it has abandoned attachment to objects of the desire realm.
But and Geshe-la explains, it’s not it’s not to say that it has abandoned attachment because there is attachment in in the first concentration, in in the second concentration and so forth. They are the attachments of the first concentration and so forth. So it has abandoned attachment to desire realm, then there’s a question that turns away, abandoned attachment to desire realm, and then aspires to higher realm, and then attaining calm abiding. Through the attainment of calm abiding, it then attains to the first concentration and so forth. So then is and then Geshe-la then explained, and is in the first concentration, having attained the first concentration, there is there one experiences happy, pleasurable feelings of the first concentration, related to the first concentration.
And there is attachment to that. Okay? And then we go to the next sentence, which is then telling us why as for this way of dividing then feeling by two, again, the the feelings that support attachment or adherence, as you have in in English text, or or things that support deliverance or support emergence, then why why why they were explained like this? Because there is a way of, how to say, being impelled towards grasping by the force of of feelings. And then Geshe-la was then explaining.
So then it is in dependence upon pleasurable feelings that attachment arises, that we then we want to meet with those pleasurable feelings and we do not want to be separated from that. And again, it’s in dependence on suffering feelings that aversion and hatred arises. So then this is what’s being explained here. Okay? So then in dependence on on the feelings, then grasping is induced, or one is compelled to grasping.
And then from grasping, one engages in activities, while engaging in activities, karma, then generating karma or acting, then through action, then saṃsāra, cyclic existence is impelled. In to understand that, then this division of suffering, sorry, of feeling, as feeling that supports adherence or attachment was explained. And then again, as for this division of dividing feeling into support deliverance or emergence, then it was explained in order to allow us to know the way in which one is separated from attachment, how to say, by that feeling that arises on the basis of the consciousness which is included in the first concentration. And then Geshe-la was then saying, again, as for attachment here in this sentence, is attachment to the desire realm. Okay?
And then I guess I was just then explaining that in the again, in the first concentration or in the concentrations in the first, the second, the third, the fourth, and so forth, there is no feeling of there is no suffering feelings. There’s nothing but happy how do you say? Happy or pleasurable feelings and neutral feelings. Okay? In in the concentrations, the first, the second, the third concentrations.
Okay? Absorption is also Okay. So then look, attachment, feeling, dependence on the actual concentration. Okay. So then Geshe-la is explaining the second sentence here, the twofold division of feelings described in order to make known.
So then the way in which we can, how to say, separate it from attachment, or free ourselves from attachment, in dependence on an actual first concentration. And then Geshe-la was explaining, so then a consciousness, which is abiding in the first concentration, or in the first absorption, has already rid itself of attachment to the desire realm. Okay? So then this way of of explaining a feeling as as a feeling that support emergence or deliverance, is explained in order to let us know there is there is still there still attachment of form attachment of the form realm and attachment of the formless realm. And then this is explained this this sort of this way of explaining feelings is is is so that we can understand this be separated from these attachments of the form and the formless realms.
Okay? Okay. Is that making sense? What is happening? So then explains, so then it is a person who has attained, for example, to the first absorption or the first concentration, it doesn’t experience that person does not experience any suffering like we do.
No suffering whatsoever as as as we do. It doesn’t experience any suffering at all in actually. And then explain that person actually has experience experience a great happiness or a great great bliss, and then there is or or neutral feelings. And then there is a great, there is a great attachment to that to that bliss, to that happiness. So then there is no suffering whatsoever.
There is only happiness, and there is then attachment to that happiness, to that blissful feeling. Okay? And then if one wants to know, to learn more about these ways of dividing things, if one wants to know this in detail, one should then study the higher and the lower text on Abhidharma. Okay. And then, if one wants to know how the ways not to allow these feelings of happiness, suffering, and neutral feelings to become the causes of the three poisons, then if one wants to know that, one should then study the texts on the stages of the path to enlightenment.
And then, again, the way if one wants to know the ways not to allow the feelings of happiness, suffering, and and neutral feelings to become, again, the the causes of the three poisons, which are then, how do say, anger, attachment, and ignorance, or another way to explain it, also, Geshe-la puts anger, attachment, and pride. And then Geshe-la furthermore means, so then, as for the way that the three poisons arise in dependence on feelings, so then in dependence on the feeling, on pleasurable, happy feelings, then the the the poison the the poison, which is attachment, arises. And then on in dependence on suffering feelings, and you have hatred or aversion or anger. And then in dependence on on neutral feelings, which do which which do not actually know the state of affairs of those feelings, then we have ignorance, which is this obscured consciousness. And then, I was explaining that that the three poisons then arise in dependence on on these feelings.
And these feelings, again, the feelings of of pleasure, suffering, and and neutral feelings then arise in dependence on contact. And then, again, contact with, again, pleasant and unpleasant objects and so forth. And then again, one was in contact with an object which is neither pleasant nor unpleasant, then one does not, consciousness does not know the way of abiding of that feeling, an ignorant feeling, that doesn’t understand the way of abiding of of the object. And then then you have, again, ignorance arising from that. And then in this way, you have the three poisons in relation to the three feelings by the three contacts.
Something which has to do with the ultimate way of abiding of of an object or of a phenomenon of a phenomenon. And Geshe-la is using a word that I just cannot identify right now, this word. I’m not sure. Okay. That’s why it’s confusing.
So he’s using a word that that is I learned to be one way of saying emptiness, referring to emptiness. But is giving a different meaning to it. A bit it’s a bit different. And I never heard the is giving right now to to this word to the meaning of this word. So, Geshe-la is saying that space is understood by means of signs, of reasoning.
And then, on the other hand, such a thing as emptiness itself is understood through its own entity. Okay. Or a phenomenon the way of of a way of abiding of phenomena. Phenomena can can be understood through through its own entity, or it can be understood by way of of a sign or a reason and so forth. Okay?
Is that making sense? So then I guess so then just saying that this this consciousness, which and then the consciousness in relation to objects which are pleasant and unpleasant, then they arise those those objects that that are perceived by those consciousness, then they arise, how to say, the for their own entity, or they are perceived by by by the by the power of their own entity. Not it’s not like they they don’t have any the way of abiding. So then that way of existence of that object, of particular object, be we talk about when we talk about it being good or bad, Geshe-la is just saying, being good or bad, that that way of existence of that particular object that it doesn’t have a maker. In some of this world, there’s no one who makes that or who creates that.
It arises. It is there by its own nature.