Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. A student’s “McDonald’s version” question about the path to enlightenment sets the tone for this 35-minute Q&A with Geshe Pema Tsering, taught to an IB Philosophy class. He explains how intention shapes what we gain from any action, then explores why Tibetan has no word for “spirit,” pivoting to the distinction between gross and subtle mind, Buddha nature, and karma as mental imprinting. He describes tantra as the intensive fast path, illustrating it with the story of Milarepa. The session extends into a candid karmic reading of Tibet’s loss of independence — why the thirteenth Dalai Lama’s warnings went unheeded — before addressing the ethics of self-defense and closing with open encouragement to pursue any form of Dharma study. Aimed at curious newcomers with no prior Buddhist background.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 08 2004 05 31 P and M.mp3
UUID: e889177c-1662-40be-8cbb-e03c13885e3f
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: IB Philosophy and Meditation (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2004-05-31
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 34.6 minutes
Words: ~3,132
Yes. It becomes a cause for us to get a good rebirth. And, if we do something with the idea that it’ll help us out in this life, then that’s the only thing that we’ll get as a reward. So, if we go to work with the idea of getting money, I’m going to work to get money, then that’s all we’re going to get out of work. If we go to work with the idea that we’re going to help others in order to achieve enlightenment, then we get a lot more out of our work than money.
Okay. So anything that we do, we do it for a reason, and whatever reason it is that we do it for, then that’s what we’ll get out of that situation. We go to work with the idea that we’re going to work to get money to buy a car, then that’s how we’re going to use our money to buy a car. Right? And if we go to work with the intention that we want to buy a house and pay it off, then that’s how we’re going to that’s what we’re going to get out of going to work.
If we go to work with or we do anything with the idea that we’re doing this in order to become a Buddha, right, and that’s a more long term goal, then then that’s what we get out of that action. So if we can stop there. You have questions, please say them, instead. The spirit. Spirituality.
The heart. Uh-huh. Okay. That can work. It’s just that I’m trying to figure out.
Okay. Okay. The spirit. There’s no word in Tibetan for spirit. So I’m just sitting there going, goes, the heart, you mean the mind?
And And I said because because heart is another way of saying mind in Tibetan. There’s no separation between the two. Alright? And then I’m going, you know, there’s something else in English that we have that I just thought maybe So there’s this thing that they have in Tibetan Buddhism that there’s and in Tibetan language, hence, which makes it easier to try and is this idea of gross minds, thoughts, and so forth. And then there’s a really subtle mind, which is probably more similar to what you’re talking about, which is still mind, but it’s very subtle.
So we have a very subtle mind, which is sometimes called sometimes has a characteristic that is called the Buddha nature. It’s the potential to become a Buddha. And whenever we do something, we put like an imprint on that mind stream. We habituate that mind stream towards something. And if we keep doing positive things, then we habituate our minds being completely positive.
So we have a very subtle mind that takes the imprints, that takes the karma. It’s basically just karma is just putting imprints on the mind, habituating the mind towards certain things, then have to experience result. But spirit, there’s no such thing as like a there’s no word for spirit, if you know what I mean. So yeah. Yeah.
I don’t even know how to start translating. Yeah. But you wouldn’t bother. You would just say, yeah. Yeah.
Spirit. Whatever. Yeah. Yes. Mhmm.
Us. It’s so sorry saying meditating on emptiness sounds incredibly pretentious in Tibetan. It sounds like, I’m very cool. But it’s but we didn’t but so it’s just that it’s just when you translate it. But oh, yes.
Everything that we do But it’s positive. It’s a it’s a virtuous action. So it may be a positive action and it may actually be a positive action that’s a cause for achieving a realization of emptiness and achieving Buddhahood. But because it’s done with a mind that’s based on ignorance, it’s still a contaminated action. Because something is contaminated by ignorance doesn’t mean it’s not virtuous.
Yeah? The way you describe it, it takes a long time to understand things. Is it possible to get McDonald’s version where you take away Okay. There’s something that’s called the the fast path. Okay.
There’s something that’s called the fast path fast path, which is called tantra or highest yoga tantra. But the trick with it is it’s fast because it means that you can achieve enlightenment in one lifetime. But, it’s a lot more hard work than any of the others. So, you can achieve something in one lifetime, so it’s more like an intensive course than a McDonald’s version. You have to be able to have the right conditions to actually practice it.
You have to take lifetimes to get to that stage. But then in the last stage, you can do something very fast, but you have to put in a lot more effort to get it done. If you read down the life story of Milarepa, then you can get a new he’s a saint Tibetan saint called Milarepa. And he achieved enlightenment in one lifetime, but spent twenty years in a cave eating to do it. When did you’ve already done that?
Okay. So this Milarepa, right, he started off his lifetime by killing people. He killed some people and did really creative great non virtue. But through purifying that action through regrets, intense regrets and intense actions of helping others, he was able to purify his actions, develop enough merit and become a Buddha in one lifetime. But it was an intensive, very strong path.
Geshe-la didn’t actually answer your question. You, Buddha, you don’t have to do anything. If you’ve done it before, you don’t have to do anything this time. Yeah? Mhmm.
Tibetans. Mhmm. Notice. So it means that at some stage in the past, individuals had done something to harm the people that are harming them in return. Right?
The individuals that come together to have the collective karma to have had that experience happen to them have done something in a previous life to bring that about, including the Tibetans. No. Yeah. Yeah. And they all have the they have the common karma of being put in a situation where they’re having this experience.
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, each individual instance suffering has a cause and a condition that brings it about. For example, our bodies are said to be an instance of suffering because they are, by their nature, something that’s going to cause us suffering.
We created the causes for being born in saṃsāra by doing things from the point of view of ignorance, which is throwing karma in the previous lifetime. Then, at the time of death, because of our attachment to the concept of having a body having form, we create a condition for being born in a human realm. So, that instance of suffering which is being born as a being, yeah, has its cause in the actions that we performed from ignorance and its condition in the thought that we die contaminated with attachment to form. So there’s a cause and a condition. So it means that suffering is a generic group of instances which has a cause and a condition.
Yeah? But each individual instance of suffering comes about because of one cause and one condition. You can’t have the cause and the condition being the same thing. Yes? Sure.
I think it’s a good question. Okay. So, in Geshe-la’s opinion, the reason that Tibet lost its independence is because it was too insular. Right? It spent all its time focusing on some he said it’s not true to say they’re always practicing Dharma because a lot of the time Tibetans were fighting amongst each other weren’t focusing on Dharma, they were focusing on politics, right?
But for those who were focusing on Dharma, it meant that they weren’t focusing on anything else, right? Including making relationships with other countries, building an army, trying to defend themselves, any of those things they didn’t do it, right? And some of these leaders that you’re talking about actually tried to get Tibet to form an army. They tried to bring in modernizations and the Tibetans didn’t listen to them. They didn’t know anything about the outside world because they were so isolated.
So, they became very backward in the way that they were doing things compared to the rest of the world. So, they were completely unprepared for the when the Chinese came and they had no friends to help them out because they’ve been focused inwardly too much up until that point. And people like the thirteenth Dalai Lama said, we need to modernize. So we we had this situation with thirteenth Dalai Lama because so I guess, he said, so he it looked like or he knew what was gonna happen because he kept saying to them, you need to do this, you need to do that, you need to do this, you need to modernize, you need to build an army, you need to develop relationships with other countries, and they didn’t listen to anything he said because they thought they’d be fine the way they were. Alright?
And so there was there was all these things that he was very prescient with, kept saying you need this and this and this, and no one listened to him. And so therefore, when the Chinese came, they had no nothing to fight back with. And then no relationships to back them up. And and they because they were so ignorant, the the ministers and everything, they weren’t listening to anyone who actually knew what they were talking about. They thought, well, we’ve got a few rifles here and we’ve got a few we’ve got a few people who can shoot them and we’ve got a few cannons even, you know, we’ll be alright.
We’ve got some rifles. So when the Dalai Lama was telling them they needed to militarize and they needed to modernize and they needed to form relationships with other countries, they thought that, yeah, we’ve done that already, and they didn’t really understand. They didn’t have a clue what was coming. And then it happened like this, and they didn’t listen, and they lost Tibet. And the other thing was that you’re basically dealing dealing with a situation where you have six million Tibetans and a billion Chinese.
Right? Or not a billion, let’s say. You said a big large number that’s almost a billion. And so, basically, no matter how many Tibetans you got into that situation, no matter how many weapons you got, if the Chinese were intent on coming, they were just gonna come. Right?
And then and heaps of Chinese died, but they could just had many more resources to keep pouring into Yeah. So then he said that it and it was a weird situation when it happened because a few Chinese came at the beginning in forty-seven, right? And then more came and more came and more came and more came and more came until and by the time that the uprising happened in fifty nine, the place was flooded with Chinese. Because in the beginning, they said we’re coming to help, And so the Tibetans welcomed them and invited them in and they said we’re coming to help you. And then more and more came under the pretense that they were gonna help, and then they ended up not helping.
They they swindled them. So, yeah, basically, it comes down to karma. They had created the causes to experience their result. So he he doesn’t think that he would have said that the whole idea of having an army was more of a sense of more of an idea of what’s So he first of all, the Dalai Lama actually went to China to try and he kept trying to he kept trying to have discussions with the Chinese to figure out what to do so that they didn’t lose their country and didn’t have fight. He said the other thing was that the Chinese took all the Tibetans weapons during the stage when they were staying there when there wasn’t an all outright fight, right?
And so what happened was actually that by the time the uprising happened in nineteen fifty nine that nobody had any weapons apart from ones that they’d hidden or people like in villages and things that use them for for like hunting or something sometimes. Right? And so he said the Chinese had all these modern weapons and there was hundreds of thousands of them and the Tibetans were any people around the place because he said it wasn’t like the army that actually fought when the uprising came. It was just the people around on the streets. Say, if all these Chinese people came into our houses, right, with guns and everything, then some people would fight.
It was just like that. And they had the the crappiest weapons. He said, you know, those weapons that, like, you have to you have to do heaps of work and then they just go pop. You know? He’s like one pop.
He said, those are those are the only kind of weapons that the Tibetans actually had, so they couldn’t actually fight much. And the Dalai Lama actually was telling them not to fight. There was no point. And it’s just that during the uprising, he fled to India. So the Dalai Lama spent, even though he’s very young, spent many years going to India and China and everything trying to stop what was happening with that war.
Yes. Oh, hang on. Could you ask one, Right? So the guy okay. So there’s two and then bust.
Yes. I’m being like the chairman of the board here. Let me just Yeah. Okay. So what do you yeah.
Okay. Okay. So it depends on your intention and what it is that you’re actually doing. If, say, for example, someone is going to kill you and you kill them instead, then you’re actually coming from the thought that you’re helping yourself as opposed to helping them. That’s a negative action.
Not the same as if you killed someone just because they’re annoying you, but a negative action. If you were going in because someone was going to kill you, if you had if you hit them, yeah, even with the idea of I don’t want them to kill me, so I’m gonna hit them, right? Then that would a negative action as well. Not as bad as killing, but a negative action. If on the other hand, you had the idea that by knocking this person out or or keep thinking of the Tibetan word is dung.
By hitting them, yeah, then you were going to stop them from creating the negative karma of killing you, yeah, and save your life as well. So there was this both there was they’re trying to make the best out of the situation. That’s not non virtue. So it depends on what the motivation is. If the person motivation is to look after yourself and not care about the other person, that’s negative.
If it’s to be trying to make the best of the situation, that’s positive. Mhmm. I’m going to get what it. Yeah. So but if you have this idea of in order to stop you killing me, I’m gonna kill you, then that’s a negative action.
Yeah? Right. If they chat to the Dalai Lama and work things out that way, then it’ll be good. If they don’t, then it’ll be the same. You continue on the same way.
So if you want to do more, then you have to know more. Right? So whatever Dharma it is that you want to practice, then you have to know about it before you can practice it. So if you actually want to study if you want to practice Buddhist Dharma, then there are many classes here at Buddha House and other Buddhist centers where they teach Dharma, right? And then you can and put that into practice and there’s books you can read to help your understanding.
And if you want to practice Christianity, then that’s a good thing too and they have teachings on that and how you put that into practice. If you want to do something to be beneficial then try and have the right motivation and go to different classes and read different books. So he said, if you can take one thing away from these classes is this idea that in in Buddhism, most important things are refuge and bodhicitta, right? And so, keeping the motivation of this idea of refuge and bodhicitta, then anytime you get a chance opportunity to listen to Dharma, yeah? He said that there’s classes at Buddha House, but it doesn’t just have to be Buddha house.
There’s different people who come to Adelaide that teach and there’s other lineages, places, and there’s all sorts of things. Anytime you wanna practice Buddhist Dharma, anytime you get the opportunity to listen to Buddhadharma, that’s gonna be beneficial. But he also said other religions can be beneficial as well. So anytime you wanna listen to or you wanna learn anything about any type of Dharma, no matter what religion it is, then that’s beneficial. And I said, did you wanna recommend a specific class?
And he said, no. It’s all good. So Geshe-la teaches two other three other classes that you could come and sit in on, which doesn’t make which is like the graduated path classes. And there’s one on Sunday mornings, there’s one on Tuesday night, and there’s one on Tuesday mornings. And he said any of those are good anytime you wanna.
But yeah. And there’s also gonna be a talk by a Western monk. He’s been a monk for a very long time. And Geshe-la said, if you come and listen to him explain Buddhism, that’d be good because you don’t have to put up with an interpreter. And he and he’s been a monk for a very long time, so the the he has a lot of knowledge that he can help people with as well.
He says, but the main thing that you need to try and get the main thing of is that you’re looking for ways to try and do good things and you’re trying to look for ways to abandon negative things. So anything that you can go to that helps you develop that, anytime that you can develop your understanding of what it is you need to do and what it is you need to stop doing, yeah, then that’s beneficial. It doesn’t have to specifically be any class. Oh, yeah. Is that okay?
He’s asking you specifically. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.