Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. A doctor-patient metaphor anchors this 40-minute session from Geshe Pema Tsering on the six attitudes required for listening to Dharma properly. After briefly concluding the three faults of the container, he presents the six constructive stances: recognizing oneself as mentally ill, seeing the teachings as medicine, the teacher as doctor, trusting the doctor’s expertise, expecting recovery, and cultivating gratitude toward the Buddha. He dwells especially on the first point, arguing that afflictions like desire, anger, and pride are more controlling than physical illness — and that most people never notice because they rarely examine their own minds. A lively Q&A closes the session, covering whether different practitioners need different teachings, how long the path to liberation takes, and whether karma can be shared between twins.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 04 2004 02 09 RG.mp3
UUID: cd84955b-2cee-4a20-ad56-c5dc1039c0ba
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: Essence of Refined Gold (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2004-02-09
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 40.4 minutes
Words: ~3,490
And then we’re not really we’re not gonna be really taking on the message properly. We’re not going to be thinking, okay, the Buddha taught this in order to benefit all sentient beings, and and that means us as well. So that means that Geshe-la said that sometimes you’re gonna get someone presenting the teachings that’s a real expert and then other times you’re gonna get someone presenting the teachings that’s like him. So that means that if you have to put up with someone like him then you should try and not focus on the teacher and focus on what they’re saying because it comes down from the Buddha and it’s the Buddha’s teachings. So these three negative ways of approaching the teachings or of listening or not listening to the teachings, the three faults of the pot or the container are things that we need to abandon.
Okay. Now the three oh, sorry. The six attitudes or the six ways of thinking that we need to encourage or we need to develop in ourselves in order to listen to the teachings properly is something like, the first one is that we need to see ourselves as an invalid, someone who’s ill and who needs help because of that illness. Then we see the Dharma or the teachings, the explanations the Buddha gave as the medicine that can benefit our illness. And we see the teacher who is explaining the teachings as the doctor who is giving us the medicine.
And then the fourth one is that we see that this doctor isn’t just handing out the medicine habitually, they’re an expert who has investigated thoroughly to see what is the most appropriate medicine for us to take, and they are then handing us out this medicine. The fifth thing that we need to cultivate as an attitude is this idea that by taking the medicine, we’re going to recover, we’re going to get better, we’re going to become healthy. And the sixth thing that we need to remember is, we need to remember the Buddha’s kindness in delivering the teachings to us. Buddha’s kindness in focusing on all beings with this attitude of helping them all. So we need to cultivate these six different ideas or these six different ways of thinking when we’re listening to the teaching.
Okay. So the first one, we have to see ourselves as an invalid, as a sick person. Now this can be a bit tricky because we think I’m not sick. There’s nothing wrong with me. I’m fine, I don’t need help, there’s nothing wrong with me.
And we think that because our body is healthy, we don’t have a problem. And we have this tendency to think that we’re okay, there’s nothing wrong with us, we can, that we don’t have to do anything, we’re okay, yeah. But if we actually look at it, we investigate properly, then we’ll see that we have these like illnesses, we have the illness of ignorance, we have the illness of desire, we have the illness of suffering from losing what we’ve desired or not getting what we desire. We have the illness of anger, have the illness of pride, all of these different mental illnesses are in continuum and we don’t have control over them. And until we become an arhat or until we completely get rid of negative emotions from our mind stream, then we won’t have control over them and we will continue to be ill.
So, for example, we have the illness of desire attachment to things and we can watch it in our mind, we can watch it come up in our mind really regularly. There’s something we want, we see a thing we want and we do, we work really hard to get it whether and until we’ve gotten it, we concentrate on that. So if it’s something that we can get easily, it doesn’t last as long, other times it’s more difficult, work really hard and we invest a lot of energy in getting things that we want. Another illness that we see keep seem to keep suffering from is hatred or the way that hatred manifests as anger. Now when anger arises within us, when have a feeling of anger, it’s so powerful and it’s very difficult to control and we all know this experience, we all have that experience a bit of losing it because we’re so angry.
So this anger it works in the same way as if we have a really bad headache, if we’re like suffering from a really bad headache, then until we get that headache under control, we’re unable to do anything else. Yeah, we need to get the headache under control before we can do can get on with anything else. It’s the same with anger. Anger is so powerful that when it takes some control of us when it comes up, we need to deal with the anger before we can focus on anything else. Yeah, so it’s ridiculous of us to say, I don’t have a problem.
I don’t have any, there’s nothing wrong with me. I have no illnesses I need to deal with because we’re dealing with things that in terms of our like negative emotions or afflicted ways of thinking that are actually more powerful than a lot of illnesses, physical illnesses that we may have to deal with. Okay. So the reason we don’t think we’re ill is because we can consider only physical illnesses to be illnesses and we don’t think about the illnesses of the mind, the negative ways of thinking that we have in our mind and how controlling that they can be on us as well as physical illnesses. So, we don’t think we’re ill because we only think about ourselves physically and we don’t concentrate on our mind very much, we don’t investigate our mind very much.
So, what we need to do is start investigating that mind and then we’ll see how ill our minds really are we’ll see the different negative emotions and negative thoughts that come into our mind and control us we’ll be able to see that if we start focusing on that. And in the same way that a doctor can give us medicine for our physical body then the teachings can give us medicine for this for these negative illnesses of the mind. So the the Buddha helps the illnesses of the mind, and the doctors help the illnesses of the body. Okay. If we investigate in this way, then we’ll see that these negative ways of thinking that we have the negative emotions that we have are actually very strong illnesses that we need to get rid of.
And we need to understand how they’re illnesses, so we need to look at what they cause in our in our mind stream or how they cause us to experience things and we need to investigate ways of getting rid of the negative effects that they have on us. So for example, if we look at desire, we think that maybe desire doesn’t harm us, but we are so under the control of desire and we do so many negative things because of our desires that the results of which are only going to be suffering that we have to look at desire as being an illness that we need to get rid of or attachment as being this illness that we need to get rid of because by that we’re only going to experience suffering. The same as with anger we keep thinking it’s that person over there or it’s that object over there or this situation over there that is the cause for my experience of suffering and therefore we get angry. And so because we don’t understand the situation properly, this anger leads us to be confused and to act in a negative way that’s going to cause us to experience suffering.
It’s the same with pride, it’s the same with ignorance, it’s the same with any of what are called the six root afflictive emotions. So any of those cause us to experience, they cause us to experience uncomfortable situations and create the causes for suffering. So if we want to look at a definition of what is an illness, then we have to say an illness or something is something that causes us suffering, right. And so because we’d have to define an illness as something that causes us suffering, then we have to see that the main illnesses that we should deal with are these negative states of mind. Okay.
In the same way where we have to look at them the Dharma or the instructions or teachings as being like medicine. Now the reason that we need to look at them like medicine is because in a similar way that if a doctor investigated thoroughly, knew our illness properly and had the right medicine in order to cure our illness and then they gave us that medicine, but we didn’t actually eat it. Yeah, sorry in Tibetan you say eat medicine. If we didn’t actually take the medicine then we wouldn’t, we won’t get anything from it. If we don’t actually take the medicine there’s all of the investigation, all of the understanding goes to waste.
We have to take the medicine as well as receiving the medicine from the So this means that in the same way, if we are listening to the Buddha’s teachings, if we’re listening to the Dharma and we don’t incorporate it if we don’t if we just listen and we don’t kind of take it in and then after we’ve taken it in if we don’t think okay this is what’s going to get rid of my attachment, this is what’s going to get rid of my anger, this is what’s going to get rid of my pride and my ignorance if we don’t think in that way and we just we just let it go we don’t try and implement it, we don’t first listen, then contemplate and then meditate like and practice really hard, put in a lot of effort to try and put to incorporate these teachings into the way we think into the way we act. And if we don’t work really hard at doing that, then it’s not it’s like we’ve been given medicine but we haven’t taken it. So so so we need to also see the teacher as being like the doctor who is dispensing the medicine.
First of all, however, this doctor has to point out to us that we’re actually ill because we don’t actually realize that we’re ill, we think that we’re fine because we don’t understand the negative consequences of the afflictive emotions that we have become accustomed to in our in our mind stream. So first of all, we have to have that pointed out to us. Then because the Buddha’s teachings were instigated because the Buddha taught in order for us to get rid of the causes of suffering because the Buddha taught because he wanted us to to be able to be free from suffering, then we have to be able to apply these teachings to our minds so we can get rid of these these negative emotions that are causing us so much suffering. So in this way, we have to rely on the doctor to show us what’s wrong with us. And then we have to rely on the doctor to give us the medicine that we can actually incorporate in order to get rid of what’s wrong with us.
That’s causing us suffering. Okay, so the doctor is an expert who has investigated thoroughly and once we take the medicine then we will get better we’ll get rid of the negative emotions in our mind stream and that will cause us to stop experiencing suffering and so that’s actually the third fourth and fifth of the different attitudes or different ways of thinking that we need to adopt. The way is to think of the Buddha the sixth thing we need to think about is the Buddha’s kindness because if we’re looking at who came up with this medicine who investigated the situation to see the way things actually were and understood what it was that we needed to know in order to get better, in order to get rid of these afflictive emotions that are causing us so much suffering. If we want to know who explained this then we have to say it was Buddha because only a Buddha, only someone who had put in that much effort to get rid of their negative emotions and to develop themselves, to develop their potential, Only someone like that could be able to explain the teachings in such a clear manner that would benefit us so much.
So we have to be very mindful of it all to develop a sense of gratitude towards Buddha for going through all that they they have gone through the Buddhas for all they’ve gone through in order to and be able to show us the path and in order to be able to explain what it is we need to do. Okay, so then once we’ve developed this idea of what the Buddha’s role was and how kind the Buddha was in showing us showing us these teachings, then we have to develop or we should we should based on that understanding develop a concept of refuge. This idea of looking towards the Buddha’s teachings, looking towards the Buddha’s explanation and the Buddha’s realizations for a path to get us out of our sense of suffering so it developed the idea of going for refuge to the Buddha and then based on that which is enormously beneficial then we are able to develop the correct way to listen to the teachings. So if we’re able to listen to the teachings in this manner then that will be enormously beneficial and will give us the right ways or the right means to put in lots of effort in order to practice it.
Okay. So we’ll just finish there for today. Oh, so that’s it. Anyone could pass? Alright.
I finished. I’m gonna stop now. Has has anyone got any questions? He’s like, come on, bring on questions. Did you guys hear that because he wasn’t speaking up.
Is it with the medicine analogy, is it possible that some people are gonna need different medicine to different to other people? So for example, some people may need to be to get teachings that ground them in the lower scopes and then other people realize their lower scopes fairly easily and need to focus on the higher scopes. Is it possible that different people need different medicine? I said, yes, there’s different beings with different capabilities and different understandings and different strengths and weaknesses. So, therefore, if it was Buddha, then they could look directly at that person and see what would be the most beneficial for that person.
Geshe-la says, because he’s not a Buddha though, he has to teach everything because he doesn’t know what’s gonna be beneficial. So, he has to try and teach as much as he can from different. Yeah. I guess I have some question about the, how long does it take to fill up the vessel in terms of like you’re taking on this, you’re asking how long it takes. How long the patient?
Like, on what period of time? The Yeah. Okay. Did you guys hear that? Yeah.
Yeah. Okay. Okay. He said until you’ve achieved liberation. So, until you’ve completely gotten rid of all your faults and completely developed all your qualities, that’s how long it takes.
Yeah. So, the way to get rid of the hole in your pot is to first of all listen well and then to what do you say protect what you’ve heard. And so don’t just casually listen but once you’ve listened think okay he said that and he she said that and go over what you’ve heard. And by doing that then you protect what you’ve heard. You don’t just you have to listen well and that means, like guarding what you’ve heard not just casually thinking about it.
But it’s tricky. It’s it’s difficult though because we don’t have that much experience of listening to teachings. So if we’ve got something that we do on a daily basis and someone said to us, for example, we’re doing a job right and they said something to us about our job because we’ve heard it so many times and because we have so much experience with it then we remember it instantly and excuse me if someone after that asked us what that person had said we would remember it instantly because we have experience and familiarity with that subject. When we’re coming to teachings about Buddhist Dharma however, it’s not something that we have that experienced with. So we actually have to put in a lot more effort to try and retain it and we have to listen a fair bit until we start retaining it properly.
I said, I think they run a question. He goes, oh, maybe kind of. Oh, yeah. Maybe maybe. Can I ask him?
You can. Well Can we have too much? This isn’t about taking things at one time and getting a lot at one time. It’s about doing something over extended period. So you can’t have too much medicine, but you’re gonna take a long time to take it, if that makes sense.
I guess as I said it’s not something that you have one type of medicine for and then it’s gone. It’s not an illness that’s cured that easily. It’s more like TB than other illnesses in that you have to keep taking medicine for years and in big doses in order to get rid of it. It’s something that you can’t have too much of it that you have to work at it for a very long time in order to get somewhere. And even if you don’t understand it and it feels confusing, what you what is happening at the time is like you’re putting imprints on your mind stream, which means that you’re habituating yourself towards that teaching.
So it becomes clearer and clearer and clearer even if it doesn’t make sense at the beginning. Yeah. I’m trying. Okay. I can’t see you.
That’s all. She gets, if like, for example, if she gets happy or he gets happy, then that, okay. Sure. Okay. Okay.
Okay. Sorry. It didn’t really translate, so I had to do a bit of backwards and forwards ing. Okay, so. Okay, now the reason that you’re experiencing these experiences because your twin’s unhappy, you become unhappy is actually because of your connection with your twin based on love and friendship, yeah, very close love and friendship and a bond and this is really weird without seeing your face and right.
So it’s not that you have the same, it’s not that you have interchangeable karma. Yeah, it’s not that you that something that you do and that it’s something that you do that your twin will experience the results of or something that she does you will experience the results on. The feelings don’t come about because you have the same mind stream they come about because of the connection between the mind streams, right? So there’s connections between us and many other beings on earth yeah or in different places. Everybody in somewhere I know is connected except sometimes the connections are stronger, right?
So your experience of sadness isn’t because of your twin’s experience of sadness it’s because of your love for your twin or your connection with your twin. So therefore if you achieve enlightenment there is no sadness in enlightenment but it will benefit your twin in that you because of your strong connection with your twin, you will be able to help this person develop realizations. Because if you have this idea of praying for other beings because you have love or compassion for them, it benefits them because of their connection with you and it benefits their mind stream to have someone praying for them, but it also benefits you because you’re doing the praying because you’re thinking of focusing on someone else as well. Okay. But the the whole idea of you experiencing something that you that someone else has created the causes for is impossible.
Yeah. So, if you create the cause of something, you have to experience the results of it. And if your twin creates cause of something, they have to experience the results of it. It’s not interchangeable. You can’t have interchangeable karma.
You can be beneficial, but you can’t change it. Yeah? Yeah.