Audio recorded at Buddha House Adelaide. Transcript auto-generated and AI-corrected; may contain errors.
About this talk. In this 45-minute commentary, Geshe Pema Tsering distinguishes three types of karma: throwing karma (which determines the realm of rebirth), establishing karma (the craving-laden last thought at death that activates that potential), and completing karma (which shapes the happiness or suffering experienced once born). He traces ignorance — grasping at an inherently existing self — as the root cause of samsaric rebirth, using a seed-and-water metaphor to show why the right karmic conditions must coincide at death. A Q&A addresses whether long-life practices can extend a lifespan fixed by throwing karma, why venting anger feels good yet destroys accumulated merit and harms others, and whether karma is inherently existent. The session closes with a vivid analogy: ignoring positive action is like a child choosing a lolly over a dollar — they don’t yet understand what the dollar can buy.
File metadata (for organising)
File: 02 DB K 2003 10 28.mp3
UUID: 6d5bd425-0904-4532-8e8a-2019a1af5513
Teacher: Geshe Pema Tsering
Collection: DB Karma (Geshe Pema Tsering)
Date: 2003-10-28
Recorded at: Buddha House Adelaide
Duration: 45.1 minutes
Words: ~3,725
The thing that causes us to be born as a human, for example, and as a human, we’re said to have much more happiness compared to the beings in the lower realms, much stability and peace of mind compared to the other beings. So, in order to be born as a human, we had to have done something very good in the past. Had to have done something very virtuous in order to create the cause or reason for being born as a human. Now, the reason that we were born as a human, or that particular karma or action that caused us to be born as a human, is what’s called throwing karma. Throwing karma and establishing karma come together in order to create the cause for us to be born in this realm.
We have to have both of those things together. So that’s how we get born as a human. If we are experiencing happiness in this lifetime after being born as a human, then that’s the result of what’s called a completion karma. There’s these three different types of karma in this way. There’s the karma that creates the causes for us to be born in a certain realm.
There’s the establishing karma that brings that karma into existence. And then there is the completion karma, which creates the conditions for of which we experience once we have been born in that existence. So in order for us to have been born into an existence like we have now, then we had to establish we had to sorry. We had to have the right throwing karma in order to be born here, then we had to create the right establishing karma in order to be born here. Then because our existence within the human realm has happiness in it and has wealth in it because of the way that we are born and the experiences we have, then we had to create the right establishing karma sorry, completing karma in order to experience those happinesses.
So we had to have done something very, very good in order to get where we are now, because we have these three different positive causes that have come together in different ways in order to get us to where we are now. Okay. So in order for us to come into existence, though, as a human being, we’re still within saṃsāra. So we have to still create the causes for us to be experiencing saṃsāra. The first cause or the first reason that we actually take rebirth in saṃsāra is what’s called ignorance.
Ignorance is the mistaken idea or mistaken conception of an inherently existent self. By thinking that we not only exist, but that we’re really important, and not only that we’re really important, but we’re a lot more important than that person over there, then we grasp at the inherent of our being, and by the power of that, this is how we take rebirth and saṃsāra. Grasping an inherent existence, and specifically the inherent existence of self, is what’s called ignorance. The reason it’s called ignorance is because it is a misperception of reality. It is not the way that things actually are.
It is the way that we perceive things to be, but it is not the way things actually are. Because it is a misperception, we call it ignorance. It is not a misunderstanding of the way things are. So this misunderstanding, this grasping at the inherent existence of ourselves and other, this is the the thing that brings us or the main cause for us to be born into saṃsāra. The reason that we get born in saṃsāra is from this ignorance, from this idea that we exist as an inherently existent being.
What comes next after this idea of inherently existent being is I want to be happy. I want to experience happiness. I don’t want to experience suffering. I’m going to do what I can in order to experience happiness. Now, this thought, this I want to be happy, that’s already the karma, that’s already the action that creates our birth in either the human realm or in the God realm.
So that’s the reason that we’re stuck in the desire realms even we’ve created positive karma. That’s why we’re still in saṃsāra, is our desire for that kind of happiness, that dualistic concept of I need that. This is the reason that we get born. This is the action. This idea of I, I, I, I, and I want to be happy is the reason that we get born in saṃsāra.
Once we have that idea, we’ve already we’ve already created the cause for being reborn. Okay. So we’ve already created the karma for we’ve already created the karmic cause of being born in, yeah, sense of realm of either the god or human realm if we’re doing something positive. We haven’t actually been born there. How we go from creating the cause to being born there to being actually born there is by the actions that we undertake after we’ve developed that intention or that idea that we want to be happy and we have this dualistic or this inherently existing concept of what I is that needs to be happy.
So we get this idea that I am going to do this and this and this, whether it’s actions of body or speech or mind in order to get that outcome. Now these actions of body, speech and mind that we have are the causes, are the reasons or the karma that we create, which leads us to experience that. We’ve already created the cause by thinking, I want to be happy, I’m going to do this in order to get there. The actions that we do after that, the actions of body and speech that we do after that are the reason or the cause that links us from that beginning idea to actually being reborn. Okay.
So the connective action or the the throwing karma that we have created in our lifetime, like the causes that we’ve created for being born in either a human or a god realm, for example, in the in the previous life, together with the last moment of consciousness we have as a being, as a God or a human, which is called the establishing karma. So if those two causes come together, the cause is throwing karma that we have established or collected through our life in conjunction with establishing karma that we get at the time of death, then we create the complete cause for being reborn as a human or a god or whatever realm it is we are going to be reborn in. The establishing karma that we have is the last thought that we have before we die. When we were talking about the death process, we got to the stage where we were beyond consciousness, where we lose consciousness. At that moment, we usually have attachment to the body that we have just left behind, and that is what is called establishing karma.
If we have attachment to the body that we just left behind in terms of being a human or a god, for example, and then we have developed during that lifetime the throwing karma, or the causes to establish a throwing karma that will work together with that establishing karma, then we re reborn as a human or a god. So we need these two different conditions or two different causes or two different types of karma. We need the throwing karma that we have accumulated through our lifetimes and then at the moment of death the establishing karma is the the wish or the the the clinging to the idea of a human or a god. So if we’ve got these conditions where we’ve created positive the positive causes of developing a throwing karma to be reborn as a human, and we have a mind at the time of death that is thinking about the desire to become a human again that has that as part of its thought process. If we have those two things together and we have done positive things in our previous lifetime, then we will create positive conditions in our rebirth as a human.
If we have been doing positive actions, then we will experience much happiness when we are reborn as a human, for example. We have created the throwing karma to be born as a human by practicing positive actions in your life, establishing karma to be born as a human by not having an extremely negative thought, or wishing for enlightenment, which would take us out of saṃsāra at the time of death. We have created the positive karma in the previous lifetimes in order to experience happiness in the next incarnation as a human. These three things come together in order to establish the circumstances of the next life that we’re going to be born into and the conditions that we will experience in that lifetime. Okay.
So the first thing we were talking about was our ignorance. Now this ignorance that we have about the way that things exist, the way that we think that we exist inherently and that all things exist inherently, that basic ignorance, which is called grasping at the inherent existence of person, gives rise to this idea we have of wanting to be happy, of being attached to the concept of being a human or the concept of experiencing some sort of samsaric happiness. This ignorance gives rise to this karma that we create, these actions that we do towards being reborn in saṃsāra, towards being reborn as a human or a god if it’s positive. After that, we have a consciousness, and this consciousness is the place where the imprints from our previous actions are stored. The consciousness has the imprints of our past positive and negative deeds.
These three things together, the ignorance, the connective action or the accumulative action that we do, and the consciousness together, they’re what’s called the causes of taking rebirth. So they’re the the three causes for for being for throwing us into the next life. Okay. So this condition is what’s called the thank you. These conditions are what’s called the three causes of throwing karma, the three causes for us to experience being reborn in saṃsāra.
They are like the seed, the imprints on the consciousness we have. These three conditions together: the consciousness, the imprints, and the ignorance. These three things create the cause for us to be reborn in saṃsāra. They have to come along with something, though. They are like a seed in the ground, which doesn’t grow unless we add water to it.
This is the seed for us to be reborn in saṃsāra, but we need water in order to create the actual cause for us to be reborn in saṃsāra. This is what’s called the craving or the desire for a human body, the desire for some kind of existence. That is like the water, that is the cause for us to be reborn in the next life. Now that is what is also called the establishing karma. So these two things need to come together.
Okay. So this this first thing is we’re talking about the water, that craving aspect that we have at the time of in the metaphor of the seed, what’s like a water, this craving aspect that we have in our mind that is looking to be reborn in saṃsāra because of attachment. That’s the first aspect of establishing karma at the time of death. The second type is what’s called grasping, or the looking for something. It’s not just the desire but the actual looking for something.
This is likened to the heat or the sunlight that warms up the seed in order for it to give birth. So that’s like the actual looking for something or grasping at something is the second condition. The third condition is actual generation of the seed, the actual germination of the seed, where it comes into being, and it’s called existence in the twelve links of dependent origination. So this craving, grasping, and existence are what’s called the three aspects of the establishing karma that we also need in order to become in order to be born. Okay.
So we have these three different types of karma. The karma that we create during a lifetime, which is a throwing karma. It is a karma that we create at the time of death, which is the establishing karma. And the karma that takes us through to the next life, which is the completing karma. This is also divided into three different types because there is a karma that we are creating in this lifetime that can also ripen in this lifetime, can ripen in the next lifetime, or can ripen in the lifetime after.
There is karma that we create at the time of death, is the establishing karma that we were talking about. Then there is karma that we create the next life that can ripen in that life. Therefore, we can have karma that ripens in the next life. After we are born, it can ripen in that life, in a future life, or in the next life, or a future life as well. So there’s many different enumerations of karma.
I think so. Did you get it? Oh, yeah. Yeah. That’s it.
So yeah. So if anyone has questions. Yes. With karma. Yeah.
With with karma, I presume with karma, it’s already decided how long your life’s going to be. And Which karma? Born. Through the throwing karma. Yeah.
Okay. Yes. So what’s the purpose of long life Uh-huh. Success. Right?
Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Okay. There is there to extend the no.
So the question was, I have to remember the question. If our life is if the the length of our life is established by throwing karma, what’s the point of doing long life practices? K. And now the if if, for example, your life is gonna be fifty years because of your throwing karma, by doing long life practices, you can make it sixty or seventy. So it’s not certain because you can die be you can have the throwing karma to live for a certain amount of time and die before that, so therefore, you’re the throwing karma is exhausted, but you still die, and you can extend that in the period of time that you live.
Okay. So you do have the potential to live for that amount of time, but you may encounter some conditions that mean that you die younger, and you may also, by doing long life practices, extend the length of your life. Yep.
Why isn’t the result Why isn’t that? A positive result? Okay. So yeah. How do I repeat that?
I’m trying to remember to repeat everything for the team. Okay. I’ll ask a question now. Okay. You made me feel better.
Hang on. First of the question is, so if the results of negative actions are suffering what happens if we yell at people and get it off our chest and we feel better? How can we say that that’s a negative result? Geshe-la said, You may feel better, but the other person won’t. Created suffering in someone else, so you can see the result of that action is actually suffering, it’s just not necessarily your suffering.
Okay. So you may feel better because you’ve gotten angry, but in actual fact, you shouldn’t feel better for getting angry because what what you’ve done is really stupid. Because by getting angry, not only have you hurt someone else, but you’ve also wiped out a whole bunch of positive karma that you’ve created and you’ve created. And getting angry in itself is a negative action, which will mean you’ll experience suffering in the future. So even though you may feel better in a short term, it’s not gonna be it’s not gonna make you feel happier in the long term.
Okay, so now you know this when you get angry at someone else, you’re not going to think, Oh, feel better now. You’re going think, Oh, damn, I just got rid of all my positive karma. And there’s not going be any happiness in that either. So it’s like the happiness that we can feel after expressing anger is samsaric happiness. It’s something that doesn’t last and actually gets worse and worse and has no definite base.
Now that you know this, then you can see that getting anger has no point and not feel happy about having been angry. Yep. I can see your hand. Can’t see your face, but I can see your hand. Sorry?
Is karma inherently existent? Okay. Is karma inherently existent? Okay.
I’ve gotta get the expression right. I’ll try and get the expression right. No. No. No.
karma karma is an existent thing, and if it’s an existent thing, it’s a not inherently existent thing. So if something’s an thing exists, it’s inherent it’s not inherently existent. That makes sense? Mhmm. So non an inherently existent thing is a nonexistent.
So an existent thing or something that exists is not inherently existent. Conversely, there is no such thing that is inherently existent. Despite this fact, we perceive most things as being inherently existent. He didn’t say things don’t exist. He said existence are not inherently existent.
Yeah. So they do exist. They just don’t exist inherently. They exist by being labeled a connection a collection of causes and conditions is labeled as existent. But there is a danger.
We have to be careful that there is a danger of of falling into the extreme void voidness or nihilism. Yep. And using that seed analogy, I was one thing on the other thing. It’s like the seed is, you know, the seed and there’s the the conditions and the causes of the sun but what’s the seed actually planted into? Is that this realm or is it because that’s never been brought up, like, seed into the ground.
I know it sounds strange, but No. No. No. That’s fine. That’s just yes.
There’s a danger in picking holes in Bruce’s metaphor. Ah. No. That’s fine. Okay.
So where’s the seed? We keep talking about the seed metaphor and the seed being planted. Where’s the seed planted? Okay. I said, so where’s the seed?
He goes, in the ground. What are you talking about? In the field. That’s what you want to see. And I went and I was like, An example here.
So the the the okay. The seed, this this this imprints that we have of our karmic actions, actions can’t take karmic actions. Our actions that we have done, positive and negative actions, the imprints of that are on our consciousness, the subtle mind that has been with us since the beginning of this time and exists till we achieve enlightenment. So the the imprints of the karma are carried on that subtle mind. So subtle mind is still on the ground.
Yeah. Same thing. They’re the ground. All the fields. Yeah.
It depends on how strong it is. karma that we create in this life or actions that we do in this life can have their results, if they’re very strong, can come about in this life in the next few years or so. Yeah? Depending on this if they’re very strong. If they’re not as strong, they can can we can experience the results of them in the next life.
And if they’re very weak, we can experience the results in in the lifetimes to come. Yep. Is there any action or is it only action to affect other things? Is it not the that the company is having impact? So if we do an action that’s positive towards someone else or or ourselves, then that’s a positive action.
Yeah. Positive karma. If we do an action that’s negative towards someone else, and it’s a then it’s a negative a negative towards someone else or ourselves. That’s a negative action. If we do something that neither affects ourself or anyone else, it’s a neutral action, but it’s still karma.
Is mani there? Karma, it’s the same word, yeah, karma, action, It’s weird, I was just checking because when we say karma in English it has all these connotations. But in in Hindi, it literally means in Nepali, it literally means to do. And in in in Tibetan, it’s the same. It just means the action.
It means just to do. It’s not weird. It’s just action. Yeah. Yeah.
Yep. Well, it sounds like everything’s sort of predetermined, so how can I sort of intervene? It sounds like everything’s predetermined. What what do you mean? Well, like, you know, it’s all predetermined.
You did it. You you saw it. You did it all before. So so said the only reason you don’t think you can change it is because you haven’t understood. But I don’t believe that you actually meant that question.
So the reason that we don’t think that we can change things is because we don’t understand how we don’t understand karma properly. We don’t understand properly that doing something negative will create suffering and that doing something positive will create happiness. If we understood the way that karma works the same way that we understand the way that money works, we would be doing positive actions all the time. Because we understand if we work, we get money, so we don’t think about that. We just do it.
This if we understood karma properly, then we would be doing positive actions. We wouldn’t be doing negative actions, and we would experience a change. So it’s the same it’s the same as if if you had a dollar and a sweetie and or or a lolly, and you gave them to a a two year old, then they wouldn’t be going for the dollar. They’d be going for the lolly because they don’t understand that they can buy lollies with the dollar. It’s the same thing.
We don’t understand what we can do with positive actions, so we don’t do them.